Super Mario: are you having fun with it?

I didn't buy the starter set but got Mario's House, the Guarded Fortress and all 10 character packs and I love them. Can use Yoshi to stomp on all the enemies etc, and will just pickup the starter set when it goes on sale. It also makes a excellent display piece next to all my consoles

I think that for the target demographic - i.e. children - they are very popular. I've not tried playing with it myself, but I suspect the interactive element - where Mario reacts to stuff you do - is probably key to kids enjoying it.

I personally am having a hard time understanding the appeal of this theme. This whole gimmick is gonna get old rather fast in my opinion.
Regardless of how the sets seem to be "flying off shelves", I don't think the line will be succesful in the long run, especially after the novelty of it wears off.

I got the starter set just to have sound when scrolling the LEGO NES TV. So if you have the NES, definitely get the starter kit for the full experience. I am impressed with the tech inside that little guy. But I agree. I love Nintendo but I will probably not be buying any more courses with all the SW sets coming Sep 1. I bet kids LOVE these though.

Edit though: I like all of your reviews both large and small and they often talk me in to purchasing. A review of a few expansion sets build and play functionality would be appreciated. Maybe one review that hits several high points?

I too am in the queue for a large discount. I have also started buying the character packs 5/10 so far. I am not sure if anyone can confirm but I was up to about £550 if you wanted all of this.... and I imagine a dedicated room or very large Dining table.... Maybe if you owned a castle..... I will also get some of the add on packs at discount..... I wonder how much of it is tech. How much cheaper would it be to make a simple lego built non interactive mario etc.......

I would have been so happy if this was a regular theme with full scenery, minifigures and molded figures. Why did we have to get these large-scale cubist abominations, and make it electronic? The NES is the only set in the theme I'm interested in because the rest is so disappointing.

I certainly think the technology is neat, it honestly reminds me of a more modernized and refined take of the idea behind Galidor's Kek Powerizer (yes its weird that Galidor of all things is my frame of reference for it...).

But for me it doesn't fit my interests that well. I think the Starter Set would be fun to have, but I don't want to spend that kind of money on it when I can pick up Star Wars, Harry Potter, or Marvel sets or even chase down old Bionicle bits on Bricklink. I have yet to pick up this year's Crocodile Locomotive, and that is a far more attractive set to me than most of the Mario theme (other than the larger NES set). I'm okay with accepting that the Mario theme is mostly aimed at an audience I am not really a part of. If its successful though I could see it doing what Minecraft did and eventually transitioning to a more normal minifigure theme (remember Minecraft started off with "mini-biomes" for a few years before it went full minifigure). Or it could end up like Overwatch, prematurely axed once the novelty effect wears offs. I dunno, that is for Lego's sales team to find out. :P

LEGO/Nintendo did a good job promoting this. Not only did my two kids know about it and want it, they even knew the release date. They love it. Their favorite thing to do is build a level and have the other play it and see what score they get. In the 2 weeks we’ve had the starter set we added 2 blind bags and the Desert Pokey expansion. Each one added a new dimension for them to build and strategize around.

Also, because Mario responds to color and not just the special stickers, my youngest likes to play around the house having Mario land on different surfaces to see the chest screen register as grass or sand or lava. They are both years-long fans of the different Mario games so the characters and specific details of the sets really resonated with them.

I’ve not bought the starter pack for this very reason - I don’t really see the point. I do however recommend the little character packs - they are brilliant, look excellent, and are very very well priced.

They're flying off the shelves because it's Lego Mario. I've dreamed of Lego and Mario being together since I was just barely old enough to get into either, and I know that I'm far from alone on that sentiment. It's a bit baffling that it took so long for such a collaboration to happen.

Although I can see this strange gimmicky idea continuing, I don't doubt very much that we'll eventually get the more regular sets that I (and I imagine many others) fantasized about as a child.

Now to wonder when Lego Pokémon will happen...

(Yes, I know someone else who shall remain nameless already has that license.)

I’ve been having lots of fun with it, much more than I expected, and I only have one expansion set and the power-up packs. I am a fan of Mario which is probably why I enjoy it so much, although it does make me just want to play the video games after a while. Also, while I still want other expansion sets like Bowser’s Castle, I don’t have any great desire to buy them right now because half of them are overpriced and these sets are so hard to keep track of. Every time you want to play with it you need to set up your whole course again because it’s too big to just leave sitting out all the time, and I’m already exhausted of all the back and forth and I only have two sets. Every expansion set is also flawed because they don’t come with extra 2x? length plates to connect your sections to the starter course.

@Huw said:
" @Falderal said:
"LEGO/Nintendo did a good job promoting this. Not only did my two kids know about it and want it, they even knew the release date. They love it. Their favorite thing to do is build a level and have the other play it and see what score they get. In the 2 weeks we’ve had the starter set we added 2 blind bags and the Desert Pokey expansion. Each one added a new dimension for them to build and strategize around. "

How do they play? Define the way Mario should traverse the course and then move him round it, or just randomly jump from one barcode to the next? That's what I struggle with a bit. Why bother with the course at all, and not just line up the barcodes on the table and hop from one to the other.

"

That's what I was wondering, and why I'm not buying any sets.

I've played the 'game' with only the starter set, together with my kids.
All the characters and builds look great, but the game was very disappointing to me.
I was just hopping around as fast as I could for a minute to collect some coins, and that's it.
There's no real game element i.m.h.o.
My kids loved the sets but I'm afraid that after a few sessions they too won't be interested in it anymore.
Would be great if they (Lego group) could add some kind of 2 (or more)-player mode with a dice or so, possibly with a Mario for each player. That way you'd be able to create some kind of competetive boardgame. That would have far greater play value if you'd ask me.

"However, I'm struggling to see the point of it. I can't say I've found it particularly entertaining, enjoyable or compelling. That could well be because I'm not exactly the target audience, being neither a child, nor a fan of Super Mario."

I can completely agree with this statement in this article. I am 100% not the demographic. That said I still don't really understand it? I have read a few reviews and watched a few videos, but I just don't get the appeal. It seems like it would get kinda boring kinda quick. Bottom line is that I just don't really understand the objective/appeal.

I was waiting for some demos at the LEGO store but because of COVID, that seems off the table. Bummer. I think those demos could really help sell/understand the product.

These have only just come out in Australia, but I haven't really seen them flying off the shelves.

I suppose it's impossible to look at these new product launches outside of the context of the current pandemic ... on the one hand, it's something fun to entertain kids with while they're stuck at home. But on the other, they are extraordinarily-expensive in a time when a lot of families don't have the money to spare, if their parents even still have jobs (and a lot don't).

I look at them, and I don't get it at all. The point of a video game is following a path, doing certain things in a certain order to get to the end of the level (and get points or rescue the princess or reach the next level, or whatever). But these are Lego sets. There's no level to conquer, you can just pick Mario up and put him wherever you want to put him. The starter set is almost $100, here in Australia, and they're offering, what? Two seconds of entertainment? You're just putting things on top of other things.

"But that's what Lego is!" But it's not what a video game is, and that's my point. There's no knowledge to acquire or villains to defeat or puzzles to solve or gameplay to master. You just pick Mario up and put him on the things that make the funny noises, the end. That's the sum total of the experience, and it looks expensive and pointless.

@Huw said:
"
How do they play? Define the way Mario should traverse the course and then move him round it, or just randomly jump from one barcode to the next? That's what I struggle with a bit. Why bother with the course at all, and not just line up the barcodes on the table and hop from one to the other.

"
Why not, instead of playing video games, just press random buttons as fast as you can! ;)

I think how the track is laid out, with the connections, it intuitively teaches kids how to play. They will make up their own rules by playing together. Some kids may line up the barcodes and hop from one to the other, and that's perfectly fine, but LEGO is all about creativity, so kids will come up with ways that will make them have most fun with the parts.

One thing I wonder: you say that the games are limited to 60 seconds, but there is also a +30 seconds time brick print, does this allow a game to last forever, or is the amount of times it can be expanded limited?

@Huw said:
" @Falderal said:
"LEGO/Nintendo did a good job promoting this. Not only did my two kids know about it and want it, they even knew the release date. They love it. Their favorite thing to do is build a level and have the other play it and see what score they get. In the 2 weeks we’ve had the starter set we added 2 blind bags and the Desert Pokey expansion. Each one added a new dimension for them to build and strategize around. "

How do they play? Define the way Mario should traverse the course and then move him round it, or just randomly jump from one barcode to the next? That's what I struggle with a bit. Why bother with the course at all, and not just line up the barcodes on the table and hop from one to the other.

"

I watched the designer video on it, and I think they address it there. You treat the set's elements as those of a board game, so you are only 'allowed' to hop from one platform (typically the rounded off plate) to the next, and only if they ar connected with plates. They specially state there that kids needed this additonal guidance to make the setup work.

I know that kids can very much 'police' themselves to follow the rules of the game, or come up with and agree on a different ruleset.

@nldarklord said:
"I've played the 'game' with only the starter set, together with my kids.
All the characters and builds look great, but the game was very disappointing to me.
I was just hopping around as fast as I could for a minute to collect some coins, and that's it.
There's no real game element i.m.h.o.
My kids loved the sets but I'm afraid that after a few sessions they too won't be interested in it anymore.
Would be great if they (Lego group) could add some kind of 2 (or more)-player mode with a dice or so, possibly with a Mario for each player. That way you'd be able to create some kind of competetive boardgame. That would have far greater play value if you'd ask me."

Note to Lego Group: Bring out a interactive Luigi so that two players can compete as you mentioned.

This line is the most fun I've had with a Lego theme in years. It's not meant to be a model kit to be assembled and displayed, it's a toy meant to be played with. Because the level design structure of the sets is a frame for play, it is easily expendable with traditional blocks.

I need to write a full essay about why this works and why everyone else is wrong. At a minimum, I encourage literally everyone with the slightest amount of interest to buy the Starter Pack. This set is not a thing, it's an experience.

Moreover, I think it's a big mistake to not review every set. Each expansion pack doesn't just offer new enemies, but new gameplay mechanics. Some are about balance, others require multiple steps in sequence. They elaborate on how to play in a nonlinear fashion.

I don't begrudge anyone for how they feel about the sets, everyone likes different things. It might not be for everyone, no one is obligated to "get it." But this is the most innovative experience Lego has done in years, on par with debuting something like Mindstorms, and the integrated app experience positively compares with Lego Droid Commander.

Additionally, it's possible this is an experiment that will fade out, but I think it is more likely that this is a sign of Lego products to come. If you look at the design and marketing of Lego Art and the NES, technology, unique experiences, and disparate product formats are likely to be the future over endlessly reskinning the same minifigures and vehicles with new licenses.

@Truebrew said: "Note to Lego Group: Bring out a interactive Luigi so that two players can compete as you mentioned."

Ah, see, this? This, I could get onboard with.

Re: Huw's remark about lining up the barcodes, I've had this argument with my friends too: the ostensible point is to get the most coins. But where's the fun in lining up the bar codes? Moreover, the codes themselves are often designed to only reward unique actions, like tipping Mario from side to side on the Piranha slide. Can you do that without the set? Sure, but where's the fun in that? And it's literally easier to play it how it's meant to be played.

Let me use a real-life Nintendo story as a metaphor. When I was a kid, I wasn't good at Duck Hunt. Maybe my aim was bad, or maybe I needed glasses, but it was hard. A friend showed me a trick: if you pointed the Zapper at the corner of the CRT, you could hit the ducks without aiming. You could get a perfect score without trying! So I did that.

And then I didn't want to play the game anymore. In fact, I hadn't been playing the game anyway. The score is not the reason to play a game, it's just a structural rule that helps the game work. If you don't get that, then you should be buying these sets so Lego and Nintendo can teach you, and you'll have fun doing it.

@TWP said:
" @Huw said:
"
How do they play? Define the way Mario should traverse the course and then move him round it, or just randomly jump from one barcode to the next? That's what I struggle with a bit. Why bother with the course at all, and not just line up the barcodes on the table and hop from one to the other.

"
Why not, instead of playing video games, just press random buttons as fast as you can! ;)

I think how the track is laid out, with the connections, it intuitively teaches kids how to play. They will make up their own rules by playing together. Some kids may line up the barcodes and hop from one to the other, and that's perfectly fine, but LEGO is all about creativity, so kids will come up with ways that will make them have most fun with the parts.

One thing I wonder: you say that the games are limited to 60 seconds, but there is also a +30 seconds time brick print, does this allow a game to last forever, or is the amount of times it can be expanded limited?

"

You can only use the brick once during a run. Most special bricks are this way. If you try to scan it again, there's an error sound effect. If I'm not mistaken, it's the sound a Koopa shell makes when it hits a non-breakable block in the real game.

@Huw said:
"

How do they play? Define the way Mario should traverse the course and then move him round it, or just randomly jump from one barcode to the next? That's what I struggle with a bit. Why bother with the course at all, and not just line up the barcodes on the table and hop from one to the other.

"

They play a few ways. They play like it’s a “real” game level and have to follow the path set by the bricks. With the way the bases have connectors on 4 sides they frequently have multiple paths to choose from for each level. Then sometimes they just play with Mario jumping around and making sounds. You don’t have to “start” a game to play with him. He still makes the sounds and collects coins and gets burned by lava etc without the 60 second game element. And finally they just “play” with them as characters. Like having them talk to each other and make up a story. Most recently it was Bowser Jr trying to rebuild his castle over and over but it somehow kept “exploding” (The action feature that makes the castle topple over). Mario and the Goomba then come help him rebuild.

@Zordboy said:
" @Truebrew said: "Note to Lego Group: Bring out a interactive Luigi so that two players can compete as you mentioned."

Ah, see, this? This, I could get onboard with."

Have any extra room on that boat?

Definitely aimed at kids. And young ones at that, I wouldn't see even teens getting anything out of it. The display value is really low as well. I don't think there's much for AFOLs, unless you're a huge fan of the series, and then again, I think minifig-scale models would be immensely more popular for that demographic.

As a game, and that's coming from a huge board game collector, it has very low value. There's no competing, the optimal solution can be found super intuitively, and the fact that it lasts only 1 minute means there's much more setting up time than playing. To me, those are the usual signs of a game for children, akin to your basic roll and move. It will soon be forgotten, the main gimmick/attraction being the electronic Super Mario figure that kids will love at first, but soon forget about once they find something more mentally stimulating.

I still don't see the appeal of all his, but I understand some child physiologists have noted that a Mario who reacts to barcodes appeals to toddlers who just want a simple game of moving him around as quickly as possible. Still toddlers grow up and unless their is a challenge involved, e.g. Mario losing his life if the wrong sequence of jumps is taken, I cannot see the long term appeal. For older children the Lego board games with dice added an element of direct competition and more thought, at a reasonable price.

When I initially built all the bits from the starter set and the Monty Mole set I had a bit of fun trying all the various functions and seeing what else Mario would do - I love that if you put him on his back and leave him he falls asleep.

The following day I showed my son who is nearly 3 and he loves the game element of it and I can completely see how this would work well to keep kids playing. Racing against each other to get the most coins or making their own super elaborate level designs to make it impossible to get everything but add to the possible total coins they could get.

I’m not a fan of some of the execution of the theme - notable the lack of physical instructions and I would have loved a proper CMF series along side it to get Minifigure scale characters too, but I actually quite like the brick built figured as well.

It’s just for kids not adults. Stick to playing the actual Nintendo and have way more fun.

@8BrickMario said:
"I would have been so happy if this was a regular theme with full scenery, minifigures and molded figures. Why did we have to get these large-scale cubist abominations, and make it electronic? The NES is the only set in the theme I'm interested in because the rest is so disappointing."

Precisely.

The Nippers love it - Nipper 2 set the basic rules of play as he bought it with his money, and Nipper 1 plays it with him. It works well with 2 boys

Wow, you guys really aren't getting this. Let me try again. This set isn't just got young children, it's actually perfect for older children, because the play benefits from additional understanding.

Here's the core argument I'm going to make: what Lego Boost does for coding, Lego Super Mario does for game design fundamentals. One of the genius elements of this compared to Boost is that the coding for Boost is all done in the app. By contrast, Lego Super Mario teaches you about game design just in the relationship between the toys. It's all built into Mario. Let me give you a specific example to explain.

Nearly all of the Mario enemies can be defeated by being stomped by Mario. After all, that's the basic Mario function back to the very first games. In the toy, this is realized by scanning the codes with Mario.

At least one of the character packs doesn't work that way: Peeps. If you scan Peepa, you don't get any coins, instead Mario gets scared. The in-app assembly instructions video shows that the only way to defeat Peepa is with the star block, included with the Yoshi set and some others. So, if you want to have Peepa in your level, now you have to go back and add that block to one of the tiles. This interrelationship between different toy elements is a core principle in game and level design.

I can use another example from the starter set: the platform that spins. While Mario rotates, he gains coins, but if he falls he can't gain more. While this is a basic challenge element, maybe you want to increase the challenge. If you suspend the platform over red tiles to represent lava, Mario gets hurt when he falls.

I'm going to try to find a game design 101 explainer to link as a reference. But I want to return to a basic idea many of you don't seem to grasp: the point of the challenges and coins isn't to win or lose as a player, it's to create a fun play experience as a designer, THEN to play through that and see how well you can do.

Can't have fun with it if I can't afford it in the first place. The prices set by LEGO make this an incredibly unfair question to answer (which is not at all your fault, just unfortunate).

It's sad because I seem to be one of the only people on here who would genuinely enjoy it and genuinely understand the potential it has (and I'm not even a Mario fan). But it's all on the price, price, price. It just costs too much, and I understand the R&D and production costs that went into it and all that. But I'm only a consumer, and I can only pay so much for a LEGO set. That's as much of a fact as all the resources that went into designing and producing these sets.

If I may, I actually don't want Brickset to review the Super Mario series. Not only do you personally not enjoy them — in which case, I don't wish to force you to review them only to further sour your impression of them if they don't end up surprising or delighting you — but it's abundantly clear that it would only serve to piss people here off.

Even JANGBRiCKS, who understands LEGO products as not just appealing to grizzled adult fans, struggles to enjoy LEGO Super Mario for what it is, and that's fine too. I wouldn't want to burden him with exploring any more sets than he feels up to.

As for reviewers who are having a much better time, just2good is the best example I can think of. I suppose it helps that he's a Mario fan. Have you seen his LEGO Mario Flash (LMF) series? That's the sort of thing the theme was made for. And I love that he's made it a series. So much more to see than what's provided in the sets. Which, once again... are too expensive and don't give you much out of the box.

It's one thing to provide potential for expansion... and another to make the extra expenses basically mandatory.

I do have one gameplay gripe based on what I've seen in just2good's videos: the sole 60-second time limit seriously restricts gameplay possibilities. 1 minute is far too short for a course of meaningful length. There should be a way to set an arbitrary time limit so we can adjust it based on the length of our courses. And there should also be a "free-play" mode with no time limit at all. As this is LEGO, we should be able to play LEGO Super Mario the way we want, but the hard-coded 60-second limit doesn't really allow much freedom in this regard.

@Cooliocdawg said:
"I would be down with a LEGO Luigi, or even other interactive characters like blue and yellow toads, like the wii game. I would also love to be able to buy just the Mario figure, and then get expansions, rather than have to sink so much money on a large set that I have no interest in, just to get Mario."

I'm guessing that the majority of the starter set cost from a production expense standpoint is just for Mario. He's a Bluetooth-enabled computer with a power pack and lights and cameras to enable the scanning functionality. The starter set's other features like the warp pipe and flag are necessary for introducing the basic set construction principles. If you're just getting Mario, you don't have the pieces needed to make the game elements work, even if you get the expansions.

For those who just want characters, don't want to drop $60, and have some parts on hand, I would recommend making a BrickHeadz-scale custom figure instead. The Mario figure is basically the same size, and there are MOC instructions for one online.

Before release I watched reviews of all the sets, but had no intent of getting them myself. I just thought the system was brilliantly designed and thought-out, but was just a kids toy (and not one for all ages, like most LEGO). That changed when I surprisingly got to build and play with a starter set about two days before launch.
My uncle is the owner of an unofficial LEGO store and every summer I stay over at his place for a few nights, and this time when I was there the first batch of Mario starter sets arrived. He was already planning on getting one for himself, and because I was there he let me build it. And I can't explain how it felt to build the set and play with the figure for the first time, even if I already knew everything it could do. It was such a special feeling, I think it's because Mario is a physical thing that actually responds to everything you do with him. It's like a doll, but waaay more real. I ended up taking not just the starter set, but three extra expansion sets back home with me. And that's where the fun really started.
These expansions all had some really unique and new features that made playing a course ten times more exciting (my expansions are the piranha plant power slide, the desert pokey and whomp's lava trouble). I can just about do everything that's included with my sets in the given time (one of the expansions includes a +30 seconds block). But only this week I realized what the most fun part is with a big collection of Mario sets. It's to make a big world with all kinds of paths interconnecting all the activities and then choosing a new path every time. It's even quite challenging to make all routes as fair balanced as possible (with how many coins you can get), so in that sense it's even educational. If you do that, it can feel like an open-world videogame but physical.
However, seeing all the comments on this article, many people don't like LEGO Mario like I do. It might have to do with the target audience. I'm closing in on being 18 years old, but that isn't as far away from the age recommendations than most LEGO fans are. I think it's something different though. I think it depends on if you like playing with a physical toy. I absolutely love playing with my LEGO sets, but I just don't have time anymore to do it (and I'd need a friend for it to be actually fun) and all my sets are on display nowadays. But Mario isn't supposed to be a display piece. He's meant to be a toy, and because he interacts you don't necessarily need a companion to play with him.
But that's just my view on the whole thing. If you're still reading, congratulations! You've earned my respect.

@LegoSonicBoy said:
"If I may, I actually don't want Brickset to review the Super Mario series. Not only do you personally not enjoy them — in which case, I don't wish to force you to review them only to further sour your impression of them if they don't end up surprising or delighting you — but it's abundantly clear that it would only serve to piss people here off."

Nothing wrong with having this opinion, but I want to state that I disagree very strongly. I don't think those are good reasons not to review the sets. There have to be other reviewers who could find the appeal, and if some people hate the sets, they shouldn't read those reviews. The line is self-evidently very popular.

As a general aside, one of my enduring frustrations with the AFOL community is how strongly many people reject anything that is different. Everyone is allowed to like what they like and dislike in the same way, but there's often an anger at these things that I feel is antithetical to the spirit of Lego.

I'm not here to police anyone else, I just want to encourage more open-mindness. On a related note, it's one thing to say something is not for me or I don't like it, but quite another to say it's bad or shouldn't exist. I have no argument against the former, but I don't just disagree with the latter--it's actually wrong.

@mr_Fikou said:
"Before release I watched reviews of all the sets, but had no intent of getting them myself. I just thought the system was brilliantly designed and thought-out, but was just a kids toy (and not one for all ages, like most LEGO). That changed when I surprisingly got to build and play with a starter set about two days before launch.
My uncle is the owner of an unofficial LEGO store and every summer I stay over at his place for a few nights, and this time when I was there the first batch of Mario starter sets arrived. He was already planning on getting one for himself, and because I was there he let me build it. And I can't explain how it felt to build the set and play with the figure for the first time, even if I already knew everything it could do. It was such a special feeling, I think it's because Mario is a physical thing that actually responds to everything you do with him. It's like a doll, but waaay more real. I ended up taking not just the starter set, but three extra expansion sets back home with me. And that's where the fun really started.
These expansions all had some really unique and new features that made playing a course ten times more exciting (my expansions are the piranha plant power slide, the desert pokey and whomp's lava trouble). I can just about do everything that's included with my sets in the given time (one of the expansions includes a +30 seconds block). But only this week I realized what the most fun part is with a big collection of Mario sets. It's to make a big world with all kinds of paths interconnecting all the activities and then choosing a new path every time. It's even quite challenging to make all routes as fair balanced as possible (with how many coins you can get), so in that sense it's even educational. If you do that, it can feel like an open-world videogame but physical.
However, seeing all the comments on this article, many people don't like LEGO Mario like I do. It might have to do with the target audience. I'm closing in on being 18 years old, but that isn't as far away from the age recommendations than most LEGO fans are. I think it's something different though. I think it depends on if you like playing with a physical toy. I absolutely love playing with my LEGO sets, but I just don't have time anymore to do it (and I'd need a friend for it to be actually fun) and all my sets are on display nowadays. But Mario isn't supposed to be a display piece. He's meant to be a toy, and because he interacts you don't necessarily need a companion to play with him.
But that's just my view on the whole thing. If you're still reading, congratulations! You've earned my respect."

This guy gets it!!!

@AcademyofDrX said:
"At least one of the character packs doesn't work that way: Peeps. If you scan Peepa, you don't get any coins, instead Mario gets scared. The in-app assembly instructions video shows that the only way to defeat Peepa is with the star block, included with the Yoshi set and some others. So, if you want to have Peepa in your level, now you have to go back and add that block to one of the tiles. This interrelationship between different toy elements is a core principle in game and level design."

So basically, if you want to use one of the cheapest sets in your layout, your forced to buy a more expensive set to make it usable?

Personally, I'd not call that good level design. I'd call that price gouging.

@Huw said:
"^ Thank you. It's starting to make a bit more sense now! "

You should really read the Rambling Brick's reviews. He reviewed all of the sets in detail, and does a good job of explaining how everything works.

One thing I think some people do not get is that you sometimes can't just scan the barcodes. In order to earn coins from some scans, Mario has to detect a certain kind of motion as well, like spinning or sliding back and forth.

@GrizBe said:
" @AcademyofDrX said:
"At least one of the character packs doesn't work that way: Peeps. If you scan Peepa, you don't get any coins, instead Mario gets scared. The in-app assembly instructions video shows that the only way to defeat Peepa is with the star block, included with the Yoshi set and some others. So, if you want to have Peepa in your level, now you have to go back and add that block to one of the tiles. This interrelationship between different toy elements is a core principle in game and level design."

So basically, if you want to use one of the cheapest sets in your layout, your forced to buy a more expensive set to make it usable?

Personally, I'd not call that good level design. I'd call that price gouging.

"

It's still "useable," you just can't get coins from it unless you do it that way. The core experience works fine, but expansion sets each offer new mechanics, and some are more self-contained than others. I really like how everything fits together, but I concede that it gets expensive.

@AcademyofDrX said:
"Wow, you guys really aren't getting this. Let me try again. This set isn't just got young children, it's actually perfect for older children, because the play benefits from additional understanding.

Here's the core argument I'm going to make: what Lego Boost does for coding, Lego Super Mario does for game design fundamentals. One of the genius elements of this compared to Boost is that the coding for Boost is all done in the app. By contrast, Lego Super Mario teaches you about game design just in the relationship between the toys. It's all built into Mario. Let me give you a specific example to explain.

Nearly all of the Mario enemies can be defeated by being stomped by Mario. After all, that's the basic Mario function back to the very first games. In the toy, this is realized by scanning the codes with Mario.

At least one of the character packs doesn't work that way: Peeps. If you scan Peepa, you don't get any coins, instead Mario gets scared. The in-app assembly instructions video shows that the only way to defeat Peepa is with the star block, included with the Yoshi set and some others. So, if you want to have Peepa in your level, now you have to go back and add that block to one of the tiles. This interrelationship between different toy elements is a core principle in game and level design.

I can use another example from the starter set: the platform that spins. While Mario rotates, he gains coins, but if he falls he can't gain more. While this is a basic challenge element, maybe you want to increase the challenge. If you suspend the platform over red tiles to represent lava, Mario gets hurt when he falls.

I'm going to try to find a game design 101 explainer to link as a reference. But I want to return to a basic idea many of you don't seem to grasp: the point of the challenges and coins isn't to win or lose as a player, it's to create a fun play experience as a designer, THEN to play through that and see how well you can do."

This is such a well written comment that I wholeheartedly agree with, I think the most fun part of the whole theme is creating the levels (playing is also pretty fun)

I’m not really getting the idea to just line all of the bar codes up. To me that’s like suggesting to play Clue (Cluedo) will all of the cards face up or passing out all of the money to the players in Monopoly. If you’re playing a game, you want it to be fun, right?

In our house, one person—kid or adult—builds a course. All square tiles must be tapped by Mario, so trying to catch a player skipping a title keeps spectators involved. Whoever gets the highest number of coins wins that course. No need to overthink it. It’s a fun way to spent time with the family that 7 year olds-40somethings can all enjoy and understand together.

I got the starter pack (along with 30385 as a free gift) purely out of interest to see how it worked and to see how it interested my 10 year old son - we got one of the lower priced Hidden Side sets last year for the same reason. The Hidden Side set was built and played with once - untouched since.

The Mario Starter set 'items' were built and combined as my son decided he wanted them and we both had to race and compare our results. We then spent the next two hours reconfiguring the route, taking pictures of our layouts and saving the results in the app. That's just with the starter set. My son was really enjoying playing around trying to find ways to score higher or make it just look and play differently - the way Mario reacts depending on how you set it up. He's now made a list of all expansion sets with a ranking order for purchasing....

I'd say it's definitely a kids set but if you're there and playing with them it is good for the adult too.

Quote from my teenage son: "The problem with AFOL's is they play with it too efficiently. They just line up the bar codes because that would be the most efficient way to gain the most coins. But that isn't the point. The point is to design a level that tells a story."

A Mario-like Luigi would be awesome especially if Lego/Nintendo built some MarioKart racers for them and a customization track to race on. The SNES version already looks like Lego.

@Block_n_Roll said:
" @Huw : If you want to know why it doesn't work, just flip the scenario. Imagine if you had to build your games console each time you wanted to play with it. Madness! If you want to build stuff then get your bricks. If you want to play video games then get your console. Mashing the two together just diminishes the joy of both, surely? This is Angry Birds again...."
I think a more apt comparison would be to Super Mario Maker, not to building a console. LEGO Mario is just Super Mario Maker in physical form. And level editors are extremely popular.

I personally think it's a terrible use of a license. The builds are barely worth mentioning with a few exeptions, the idea seems to get boring very fast. I had several chances to fool around with it and I don't seem to like it one bit. Only thing I'm remotley attracted to are seperate characters like Yoshi, Goombas and Toad for example. I do somewhat enjoy Bowsers castle but that's it. LEGO would make a better move making a Nintendo based line where we would get actual minifig based sets from their popular franchises such as Mario, Legend of Zelda, Metroid and such. The Mario starter set is constantly sold out in the local LEGO store, but expansions are sold somewhat poorly. Additional salt in the wound is the fact that the sets don't come with actual physical instructions. I know it's 2020, but c'mon. I don't want to download a 700mb poorly optimised app just to be able to build a small set.

I thouroughly dislike the line and for me it is down there with the worst LEGO lines.

My 7 yr-old son is really enjoying it. He plays with it probably once or twice a day, and has finally started shifting the course around to make different paths. He wants the expansion sets, especially Bowser’s Castle.

His biggest complaint is that there’s no reliable way to get more time. Sometimes you can get extra time out if a mystery box, but that’s it.

I think it’s a neat piece of technology. It knows when you’re jumping, sleeping, walking, plus it’s got all those tiles it interacts with.

It’s exactly the kind of futuristic toy I imagined as a kid in the 1980s, finally available after a mere 35 years.

@rslotb said "I watched the designer video on it, and I think they address it there. You treat the set's elements as those of a board game, so you are only 'allowed' to hop from one platform (typically the rounded off plate) to the next, and only if they ar connected with plates. They specially state there that kids needed this additonal guidance to make the setup work.

I know that kids can very much 'police' themselves to follow the rules of the game, or come up with and agree on a different ruleset."

The number one complaint I've seen about this theme is "why don't you just fly Mario to the goalpost" and this is always my response to it. You don't just take all the money out of the bank during Monopoly, you don't move backwards five steps to get straight to your home in Sorry, and you don't just attach all the game pieces at the start of a round of Mousetrap. The entire point of a board game is you follow the rules and step on the spaces when told to, policing yourself and the other players. For a group that seems so fundamentally opposed to the idea of putting tech in a LEGO set you'd expect them to understand basic board game mechanics.

@Huw said:
" @Falderal said:
"LEGO/Nintendo did a good job promoting this. Not only did my two kids know about it and want it, they even knew the release date. They love it. Their favorite thing to do is build a level and have the other play it and see what score they get. In the 2 weeks we’ve had the starter set we added 2 blind bags and the Desert Pokey expansion. Each one added a new dimension for them to build and strategize around. "

How do they play? Define the way Mario should traverse the course and then move him round it, or just randomly jump from one barcode to the next? That's what I struggle with a bit. Why bother with the course at all, and not just line up the barcodes on the table and hop from one to the other.

"

No idea if anyone else has already answered this, but let me explain: most expansion sets have unique barcode pieces that only give you coins if Mario reads them AND you move him in a certain way. So for example, the desert pokey set has a little place where mario can stand in that has a hammer attached to it. Inside of it is a barcode sticker. If you turn this thing around, you can smash the lowest bit of the pokey cactus out and the one above will slide down to the surface. Then you can swing the hammer back and knock out that one, and so on. Mario will only get coins from scanning the barcode if he detects the swinging motion when standing on the barcode. One of the pokey bits also has a barcode, and if you scan this you'll normally get just one coin like most other enemies. But if you've smashed all the pokey blocks out prior to scanning this barcode (and Mario has detected it), you'll earn a whole lot more coins at once! The same thing goes for all other moving elements in the series, like the power slide, the simple turning or side-to-side moving platfroms and the bill barrage. You'll only get coins if you perform the moving action. Theoretically you still can line up a bunch of enemies and step on them, but you'll need so many enemies for that and there aren't that many bosses that give you a bunch of coins quickly (and bosses can only be defeated once in a game). This will cost you an insane amount of money, and for much less you can just buy a few smaller things that need actual interacting to earn you coins and you'll likely get the same score or even more out of that (because you still only have 60 seconds plus maybe a few bonus seconds).

@GSR_MataNui said:
" @rslotb said "I watched the designer video on it, and I think they address it there. You treat the set's elements as those of a board game, so you are only 'allowed' to hop from one platform (typically the rounded off plate) to the next, and only if they ar connected with plates. They specially state there that kids needed this additonal guidance to make the setup work.

I know that kids can very much 'police' themselves to follow the rules of the game, or come up with and agree on a different ruleset."

The number one complaint I've seen about this theme is "why don't you just fly Mario to the goalpost" and this is always my response to it. You don't just take all the money out of the bank during Monopoly, you don't move backwards five steps to get straight to your home in Sorry, and you don't just attach all the game pieces at the start of a round of Mousetrap. The entire point of a board game is you follow the rules and step on the spaces when told to, policing yourself and the other players. For a group that seems so fundamentally opposed to the idea of putting tech in a LEGO set you'd expect them to understand basic board game mechanics. "

It's not even that, I think. If you take Mario straight from the start to the finish, you literally get zero coins. To earn coins, the main goal of the game, you need to play it. This is not like the Mario games, where the goal is to reach the goal flag without dying. No, this is about reaching the goal post in time with as many coins as possible, which you can only achieve by taking the time to play the actual game. And there might be ways of 'cheating', if you wanna call it that, by just buying all the sets with the best ways of earning coins fast and placing them all in line, but that's stupidly expensive and you won't get any fun out of it.

Disclaimer: I'm a 26 year old game developer. Might not be target age, but sure part of the audience due to the latter.

That being said, most of the complaints I've seen like "Why bother with the course at all, and not just line up the barcodes on the table and hop from one to the other?" comes to a simple game design point: the purpose and rules of play.
Nothing is straight up STOPPING you from doing that just like nothing is straight up stopping you from playing monopoly and starting with ALL the money in the bank.
Fun in a game (digital or physical) comes from overcoming challenges that are just about above your comfort - making you invest yourself into overcoming it and gaining joy from when you do.
Lining up barcodes for Mario or stockpiling monopoly money at the beginning of the game removes that challenge and, with it, the fun.
The tough part is the same as it is with Super Mario Maker (1 and 2): not everyone is a level designer. It's hard to understand what makes a level fun to play or balanced, and when you are not constrained by the limitations the developer puts on Mario on a game (like gravity, lives, walking enemies etc) it becomes even harder to do so in real life.
A well put together level, however, will make you do tough choices, such as choosing between a tough path with multi-hit enemies but also has a 30 sec+ at the end vs a shorter route that is full of coin-earning minigames and a mushroom. It will challenge you in its lenght - short enough to be completed in the alloted time, but not too short that you will get to easily do everything in sight.
Making a Lego Mario Course that is FUN to play is tough because not only you need to be good at level design but also at Lego building. I deal with the regular bricks but rarely ever with technic and it's been a deep-dive for me, as I try to do jumping lava bubbles, auto-dropping Whomps and add more motion and interactivity in general to the segments of my course.

tl;dr: Kids will have fun with the simple interactivity of it. For adults, it can be fun. You just need to play on a well designed level - the problem is that level designing is a term and skill foreign to most AFOLs. For an adult, it won't be fun out of the box

It's very interesting, until I bought the starter set, I just didn't saw the point in this whole ecosystem. But in real life after I tried it, just fell in love in few seconds and cheers me up every time I play with it.

Lego Mario-related article: exists
Brickset users: Lame theme and no minifigures.

Honestly my main problem with this series is with the electronic Mario figure. Because of the electronics he costs a great deal to produce so he's only included with one set but it's rather expensive and every single one of the other sets is functionally useless without it. He's also much larger than most LEGO figures so the entire line has to be scaled up to match, meaning more expensive sets that don't have much in the way of play value. Lastly because of the comparatively huge battery box he has to be square and the entire line has to be square with rounded edges to match... which doesn't really match the aesthetics of any existing Mario game.

I haven't played with any of these sets, or even built any in LDD because there are so many strange new pieces. Maybe the game design aspect is heaps of fun. But it seems aesthetically unappealing and egregiously expensive, and frankly I'm still not convinced that a regular product line wouldn't have been the better way to go.

What’s not to understand about it? It’s exactly like any other LEGO play set, it just has an interactive digital element to it. No, there’s no “reason” you can’t just bypass huge areas of the course if you’re running out of time. But there’s also no “reason” the LEGO City Police can’t team up with Doc Brown and Johnny Thunder to stop Sauron?
Think about it- if you’re a kid playing with LEGO Mario, and if it didn’t have the digital elements, what would you do with it? You’d be doing exactly the same thing; you’d get the Mario figure and have him run and jump and stomp and all that stuff. The only difference is you’d be making all the noises with your mouth.
I think you’re all forgetting that LEGO is a TOY. It is something you PLAY with. The point is to have fun. And bopping the little Mario around and hearing him react to the world around him is inherently fun.
Oh, and if you think the models aren’t up to scratch? It’s LEGO, you have the ability to change and enhance them if you want.

It’s funny how so many people can have so many differing opinions. As a 40 year old AFOL I was hesitant when I first read about the Mario sets. But after watching all of just2good’s video reviews and how all the different bricks and characters interact, I took the plunge. I’m thoroughly LOVING building levels, arranging characters and seeing who can get the most coins. I know this is extremely popular as well, as Lego.com is on backorder for many of the sets. I also bought two of the last two expansion sets Target had on their shelves. It’s true it’s not everyone’s cup of tea. I feel the same about Bionicle. And Minecraft. And Brickheadz. Not everyone likes every theme. I think this is just more polarizing because Mario is such a popular character and brand.

Quote: - the problem is that level designing is a term and skill foreign to most AFOLs...

Thanks to the handful of game designers out there that have weighed in. I have to say that I FINALLY understand this line and the concepts behind them. It is interesting, then, that LEGO hasn't leaned into the "world-making" / "level-making" aspect of this more explicitly. Makes a lot of sense.

That being said...as with some others, its not for me. Personally, I justify LEGO's high prices specifically for things like the extremely well-done, illustrated and easy-to-follow instructions! That's a ton of value for me; I can't MOC or MOD to save my life. I enjoy LEGO specifically because it is one of the only things in my life for which I can just follow instructions and have something really cool and fun when I'm done.

That might make me a lame LEGO fan or a non-creative, but, hey, I am what I am. I must have built 200+ sets over the last decade and I still look at a pile of bricks and have NO EARTHLY IDEA how they are going to be connected to make something like a car or an animal, etc. It amazes me every time!

So, for the MOC'ers and MOD'ers and level creators out there - enjoy this Mario theme; it looks like fun!

@Falderal & @AcademyofDrX - Thank you so much. I really went through te comments feeling as @Huw said he was about this set. I just didn’t get it - even thinking about kids’ perspective
instead of an Afol’s like me. But reading how kids, playing together, use it as an enhancement to play and still go beyond the gameplay with imagination made me ‘get it’ why it is still true to LEGO’s spirit. And I ‘got it’ regarding its inherent appeal to Afols (when they get it) thinking about the game development potential it offers, as @AcademyofDrX pointed out.
All of that made me get it, so much so I’ll definitely get the starter and a couple of packs now!!

Sure, you can cheat and just throw Mario around scanning barcodes, but a lot of video games have cheat codes to let you do similar things - in both cases, you'd be missing the point. I'd also suspect you're the sort of person that cheated their way through tests in high school...

You have to think of this like any other multiplayer game.

If you were playing monopoly and the other player just grabbed a wad of cash from the bank, would you be cool with it? No.

If you were playing COD online and your mate was using an aimbot on you would you be cool with it? No.

If you were playing real life soccer and just picked up the ball with your hands, punched all the other players out of the way and jumped in to the goals, would everyone be ok with that? HELL no.

If you pull the stickers off your rubiks cube and put them back on in sequence, are you a speed cuber? No.

If we're playing Lego Mario in my house and someone just throws him around scanning barcodes to get coins and says they're the winner, are we cool with it? NO.

I don't see why people can't wrap their head around this concept being essentially the same. When I'm playing this with the kids we have an agreed understanding of the rules of how Mario can move, and that he has to progress through the level. Otherwise, it's cheating and your turn (and score) doesn't count.

But if you don't have friends or kids to play the game with then yeah - this whole thing isn't going to be that much fun.

@darthsutius said: "I'd also suspect you're the sort of person that cheated their way through tests in high school..."

Using cheat codes in a video game /= committing fraud.

Is it little wonder why the topic is so heated, when people are throwing around passive-aggressive judgements and baseless accusations like that? Several people have made similar remarks this whole comment thread, and I'm sure that I'm not the only person who finds them demeaning and cruel.

@lordofdragonss said:
"This is just another theme that is made to be bought, played a little and then forgoten.
It is DESIGNED to be NOT DECONSTRUCTED, which miss point of Lego completly.
ALso for the price of Starter set, you can get UNLIMITED Mario Experience by buying Super Mario Maker on Switch.

But they are also things I like. Especialy new plates that are AMAZING for Figure based Boardgame. I love new Leg pieces, eye prints and actualy solid builds for Mario Enemies."

These sets are not designed to stay the same. I don't know where you got that, but it's completely wrong. Sure, the models of the activities and characters should stay built, but apart from that everything has the purpose of being rearranged into new levels. The building instructions don't even have a guide to make a level, it's all up to you. And I think that almost every LEGO set you can get these days (apart from Creator 3in1) isn't "supposed to be deconstructed" as they all have pieces for just the model on the box without any alt builds or inspiration models. No, this theme is LEGO at its finest as it IS supposed to be built and rebuilt with!

My kids /love/ it. (mostly the 6 year old, the 4 year old likes it because then her big brother plays with her). Kids don't play the way adults do. There are huge levels and adventures happening in my house and we only have two starters so far. I think Mario1 is currently sleeping somewhere in a custom made house to be honest.

The kids don't care about maximizing coins so far, but instead creating grand adventures.

I like it as a parent because it feels less like it glorifies violence than ninjago/avengers. And when the kids tire of it, my husband wants the figures for display in his game room.

I don't understand the constant complaining about this? It's quite clearly aimed squarely at kids. If it interests your children, buy it. If not, then just ignore it. It seems a bit surreal to see grown men and women railing on about it.
Should Brickset review the sets? I suppose so. I'm sure there are curious parents who have children asking for these sets. The reviews might garner new traffic outside of your traditional audience. It might be helpful to select reviewers who have children at home?

To set some context I’m a 60 year old avid Lego collector. I was very intrigued by Lego Mario when it was first announced but decided early on not to get involved. Why? Well, for me Lego Mario falls into the same trap as previous Lego interactive sets like Lego Dimensions and more recently Lego Hidden Side. The technology behind these sets is amazing (I love Hidden Side for that) and the Mario technology looks very impressive as well. However, for me, as an older Lego collector its very hard to get into the game parts.

I like to read and understand the objectives of a game and understand at least the basics of the game play before I start. Think of board games - you always get the instruction which give you the aim and the rules. Once you start to play you gradually develop strategies of your own, but you know the goals and the rules.

The fact that Huw created his thread highlights that Lego have once again missed this important step with Mario. It’s not clear to me what the aim of Lego Mario is and what the rules of engagement are.

I understand that many will say that younger people like to discover things, but for me, and I guess many contributing to this thread, they would like more guidance into the purpose of the game. I like Hidden Side and own quite a few of the sets, but the play seems to be pretty similar across all the games and I’m still not sure what the basic story really is or what the final end goal is. As far as I know the characters of Hidden Side only appear in the game and its difficult to get impressions of who they are or their relationships. I have probably missed something in the game, but that’s the point - it should be easy to get the premise to start with.

If I were a Logo designer, I would make sure that Lego game series have clear goals and rules that are easily discoverable before purchase. For me, Mario does not do that. If it were clear what the goal was and there were some ideas of how to start achieving the goal, I’d be much more interested in purchase. Some of the posts in this thread have been very enlightening and give me some of the information that is missing from the available Lego publicity. It shouldn’t have to be that way.

I really hope that Lego Mario does not go the way of Dimensions or Hidden Side. I lament that both were excellent technology platforms but in the end failed in part, in my view, because of the lack of easily discoverable goals and rules.

To everyone complaining about the price per piece on the starter course: Mario, who has an LED screen with no delay, a color sensor, barcode sensor, gyro sensor that detects if he’s laying down, falling, jumping, etc. and is THAT compact IS NOT THE SAME VALUE AS A 2x4 BRICK!

@BulbaNerd4000 said:
"To everyone complaining about the price per piece on the starter course: Mario, who has an LED screen with no delay, a color sensor, barcode sensor, gyro sensor that detects if he’s laying down, falling, jumping, etc. and is THAT compact IS NOT THE SAME VALUE AS A 2x4 BRICK!"

True Opinion.

@Huw
Perhaps you could get one of the people who like this theme to write a guest article explaining the point behind it. I've seen some very well-written comments doing just that, but they could be missed by many people who don't have time to go trawling through all the comments.

First of all, my son who is 6.5 year old boy loves loves so much this theme. He never played any video games. He didn't know what is mario even pocketmon and minecraft. At first he just wanted a piranha plant slide.

A week later, he wants all sets in theme and wants all character packs (2 per each character).

Kids play their own way. All toy cars are racing but crashing and flying. Lego Mario is same. all characters are racing in the level my son created even without Mario. Sometimes he is sleeping in a house rather than collecting coins.
I played this like setting up all set and move Mario
to scan bar codes. Enemies never move. But my son move all enemies and attack Mario. Sometimes Mario captured by a group of turtles and fall into Lava and die. He creates his own world.
Adult like I has been stucked in a rule that we are used. That makes a Mario theme is bored. It is bored to me but my son enjoys it in a different view.

For my son I really give two thumbs up.