The next train is due soon
Posted by Huw,
It's been seven years since the last Creator Expert train arrived, so a new one is long overdue.
The wait is nearly over: the next 18+ (formerly Creator Expert) direct to consumer set is this superb Swiss CE 6/8 10277 Crocodile Locomotive and it will be available on 1st July priced at DE/FR €99.99 / DK 899DKK / US $99.99 / UK £t.b.a.
LEGO has not issued a press release for it so, after the break, you can read part of our interview with Jamie Berard at the fan media days, where he discusses the set and who he thinks it will appeal to.
Jamie, tell us about the next 18+ set!
Our next 18+ (formerly Creator Expert) set is a crocodile locomotive. What's nice about it is that, first of all, it's a train, which we haven't done in a little while.
We found that our last few trains did not appeal to people other than train fans. Of course, we love train fans, but we're just trying to make sure that, compared to our other products, trains are bringing in enough people.
The thought behind this model is that we hope train fans will still want it, and they appreciate it and love it, but we're elevating it a little more to be a presentation piece, something that you can put on display in your living room and feel comfortable showing to your friends without having to justify having a toy in the living room.
We're doing that by adding things like the UCS plaque and also a display stand which, rather than using modern pre built track pieces, uses the classic 4.5 volt rails, with brick-built track bed and sleepers.
We’ve also tried to make it more feel more mature, using a realistic colour and downplaying the minifigures, which are not shown on the front of box. I think the new style of 18+ box works really well for this type of product where it shows the model in a very classy way. The set does come with two minifigures, they are shown on the side of the box, so if you wanted to find them, you could. So, we're really excited, we think the 18+ branding is perfect for it.
Of course, it still has all the things that trains fans would expect: you can take off the roof and on the inside, we have the two minifigs, a male and a female. The section that they are mounted on lifts out so you can add Powered Up components to enable you to power it and operate it remotely: just drop them right in and it’s ready to go. No rebuilding necessary! When the set is launched the Powered Up app will be updated with a controller specifically for this set. Real savvy builders should also be able to use old Power Functions motors in it, too. You can take it off the pedestal, put it on your layout, and it’ll work.
Was it a challenge, then, to get it to work around the sharp curves and points?
It’s designed by Pierre Normandin, who's done quite a few City trains the past, so he’s expert at ensuring trains run properly. We use the same testing setup for all our trains, and we've done so for 12 years or more. So it’s nice to know that we can make something completely new that's driven by the large wheels -- It's only the second time we’ve done so -- and it actually performs really well.
So, other than train fans who exactly is this model aimed at?
Well, we found that, for example with the Ideas Ship in a Bottle set, that you don't have to be a ship fan to appreciate it.
We found people are looking to show a little of their playful side, a little of their creative side, and who want a project that takes time. But, they also want to know what to do with it afterwards, which is why we’ve made this more of a display piece than just a model of a train. As a result, I think this just has permission to belong. It doesn't have to be that you're a train fan to appreciate it, you just need to appreciate it as an interesting display piece.
After all, there's a lot of little quirky things that people put on their shelves! We hope to find that there is an audience, but of course until we sell it, we won't know! Also, with trains in general, they're starting to come back into vogue. They're trending a little in the nostalgia aspect. A return to another time, a degree of escapism that's coming into a lot of people's minds, especially in the current environment, the challenging times we are in right now. So, any time that you can think of travel and getting away and being somewhere else, even if it's in a mental state, this could offer you that escape, or an appreciation for another time. So, the historical aspect of it, we think is also an angle that people will appreciate.
Is it based on a particular prototype?
Yes, it’s based on a Swiss CE class 6/8 Crocodile locomotive built around 1920. You’ll find all the details on the UCS-style plaque.
Thanks, Jamie!
You can find more images on the set details page.
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169 comments on this article
i'm disappointed tbh
All I can say is... what an interesting choice.
I regretted not getting Emerald Night and I think I will continue regretting not getting that particular set.
I see it as a good train parts pack for the wheels and the like.
FINALLY. Now how about that Mickey & Minnie?
I had to do a double take, since my son just finished building the crocodile locomotive from Holger Matthes LEGO trains book, and this is incredibly similar. I wonder if that will cause problems.
First I'll say I love this approach to "Creator" trains. I missed the Emerald and Maersk but have two Horizon Express sets along with several City sets and they all live in bins in the basement January-November. Sometimes I put them out for Christmas but with the Winter Village train...I digress.
I don't really need a justification to put them out but they're very big and the layouts take up space I just don't have. So to see a display piece...this is really great. It may even be the first set I get a plexi case / cover for.
With all that said, I'm not sure how accessible this is to the average consumer. Being a Swiss antique it may not appeal to the US customer...maybe moreso for European? In any case, I think it looks great and I'll be picking this up for sure. Having a display train be an annual set (similar to Creator vehicles) may be a tough ask but I hope there are more of these display-centric trains to come.
From the leaks, it looked like it was gonna be larger than minifig scale, but glad they kept it reasonable.
It's not the best looking train but there are cool techniques and lots of train parts for train fans to build trains with
I appreciate Lego doing something different, however this just doesn't jump out at me. It will be a pass from me.
Jeez, how I hate this absurd marketing theories. Honestly, If I'm not into trains, there's zero reason to waste valuable display space on a train.
It is not ugly, it really looks like the original, which is ugly. For AFOL and train FANs, I suppose...
Ooh, classy! They've put some great realism into this one. I don't have much interest in model trains which run on more than one rail, but would love to get up close to this one in real life.
This brought sadness though:
"Real savvy builders should also be able to use old Power Functions motors in it, too."
If LEGO are hoping to attract buyers beyond the usual fan crowd, who probably aren't "real savvy builders", why make it difficult to use the "old" (but effective, and cheap) Power Functions? Why not design it so they can slot right on in too? The apps are alright, but adding too much complexity and extra barriers-to-entry detract from that "escapism".
I like it. Unusual choice perhaps, so much so I actually thought a leaked picture that i saw of it was a fake
Brother's Christmas gift, check!
I'll enjoy going to the Lego Store and seeing a whole wall of uninspired and lazy black boxes in a few years.
Apart from it being a train, idk what significance this has or even why its a LEGO set?
One of the easiest LEGO Expert (or what ever its called now) sets that I'm going to pass up.
I'm assuming this will be around £90 to £100 in the UK.
I have waited a long time since the Horizon Express for a true return to the "Creator Expert" train series. The Winter Village Train seemed neat, but not in the same vein as the Emerald Night, Maersk Train and Horizon Express were. The Disney train while it felt similar to the old Creator Expert trains had the licensing price tag attached to it. So although this new set is in the "18+" theme, I really feel like this set is the fourth entry in the 'series' that Emerald Night started in 2009.
Interesting there are no comments on how Lego has a long history of "Crocodile" trains, one of the earliest being the 4551-1 set and set 10183 also having a Crocodile as its primary model. So admittedly this is a train prototype that Lego has done before, so I guess their confidence for it to be a good seller is based in some Lego history with the same engine in the past. With that said... train fans are always going to be a regional favorite bunch. Personally I would have loved to have seen an absurd attempt at an American giant steam engine such as a 4-8-4 or even a Challenger or Big Boy; or a practice in Lego miniaturization via a narrow gauge engine. But even though my interest in the Swiss prototype is pretty slim, there is enough going on in this new model it catches my eye immediately.
If anything is going to hamper this set, its the drab color choice. As Bionicle fans might recall "brown sets don't sell." I hope that old adage doesn't hold true here, because I certainly don't want to wait nearly a decade again for the "fifth" entry of the Creator Expert/18+ train series.
While I’m happy to see the return of a train to the Creator Expert (or whatever) line, I don’t think this was the best choice.
I don’t think it fits any casual fan’s description of what a beautiful train is, and therefore makes for a far less appealing display model. Unfortunately I don’t see this selling that well, thereby reducing the chances of another (better looking) train in the same line.
That is really cool. Can't wait to pick it up!
That looks great. It looks a bit lonely without any carriages or wagons to pull, though. Hopefully they'll come later... or probably not.
@Spike730 said:
"Jeez, how I hate this absurd marketing theories. Honestly, If I'm not into trains, there's zero reason to waste valuable display space on a train."
Marketing people need to make themselves feel necessary. Some things don't need much marketing and others do. All they need to do is ask the train enthusiasts what they want and pick the more popular options. They did it with star wars UCS why not with trains? I am still holding out for an Emerald Night re-release, I doubt their marketing department will think that is a good idea though :( Marketing people are off in the world of possibilities rather than using basic logic. 7 years is a very long time between trains when anyone that looks at ebay will see how much an Emerald Night sells for....
I always wanted the original croc train so this is a definite buy for me.
This is awesome! Big yes from me! :-)
Like some of the other comments I was hoping for a steam train for my kids (as were born before the Emerald Night train) and the movie tie-in steam trains have always lacked the detail of moving locomotive parts, together with a few carriages for my $100 would be great, rather than an update on the Lego factory train 10183.
As a train enthusiast and O scale RR modeler, I was really hoping for a 4-8-8-4 Big Boy steam locomotive this year, but maybe next year. I do like the unique look of these crocs and I will end up picking it up.
Love the trains! Not what I expected; however, it is unique/original. Definitely a first day purchase for me. Although Emerald Night was definitely the best TLG train set released to date, I would be interested in another type of vintage train at some point. Why not be original?
Out of curiosity, is the track gauge width the same as the typical Lego train sets?
I think it is definitely something different and pretty cool looking, not sure where it fits in my collection but maybe I'll shoehorn it in. I would've preferred sand green to brown but what really gets me is that they used both plates AND tiles for the ties. I'm having trouble thinking of a good reason as to why they would do that.
I accept it's an accurate reproduction aesthetically, but to me the colour just makes it one of the ugliest looking sets ever.. yes, it's ugly in real life so you can't polish it up, but you'd have thought they'd have taken that into account when selecting what to build and then not chosen this, there must be other candidates with a wider appeal?
Just imagine how beautiful this would look in dark blue.
This is just a paperweight. Train sets should be designed to ecourage at least the basic things that trains do.... Move people and items. Where is the rolling stock to go with it? If trains are sold separately then Lego needs a dedicated accessories range to flesh it out. Saying that.... Its an inspiring choice.... For a paperweight.
As a huge Trains fan ... I have to admit. I don't like it.
I mean, it's fine, and all. But it's just, yet another crocodile engine. Woot.
And reddish-brown is not an appealing colour (as realistic as it might be), even if Lego has fixed the "brittle and fragile" issue that it had with reddish-brown for a long time, there.
I can't promise I won't buy it (if I see it cheap in a store, then maybe), but it's definitely not a day-one purchase for me, I'm reasonably underwhelmed.
I love it! For a train fan from Switzerland, this is a dream come true... -)
it just feels very visually unappealing to me. A lot of that probably has to do with the color scheme. As a non-train enthusiasit I also don't feel like every train has to be a realistic representation, just like every monster burger food truck does not need a real life model to replicate. The lego team has lots of creativity I would like to see a train in another line with real functions as an add-on. They do this with boats and airplanes already. I would gladly consider a new train for Ninjago (serpentine train was at least a try) or heartlake city, as a consideration.
I mean it has to be a Day 1 purchase because otherwise it will be out of stock by days end and won’t be back for sometime,
I like...
I'll get this one eventually.
What's with the horrible gap underneath the 3rd set of wheels from each end (in the side-on render on the set page)? I hope that's just the way it's rendered, with the red rubber tyres on the driving wheels - and not that those wheels actually hover above the track...
Can they not make a steam train? I mean if you have to do something why not Flying Scotsman? Emerald Night is a great set and if you want to get people into the new Power Functions then make some nice steam trains. Disesals are just a bit blah.
If this doesn't sell well, will Lego take that as a sign people don't want these types of models? I don't dislike this but I think a more conventional steam engine (or dare I say a new Emerald Night) would capture my interest much more.
@Spike730 said:
"Jeez, how I hate this absurd marketing theories. Honestly, If I'm not into trains, there's zero reason to waste valuable display space on a train."
I think what they're talking more about is appealing to people who aren't invested enough into trains to bother with a full layout. A set like this seems like it'd display well on a shelf, comparably to sets like other Creator Expert vehicles or Ideas sets like the Saturn V rocket. There's a lot of people who that might appeal to who don't typically consider themselves train fans or collectors.
I wish there were a “Maybe” or “Maybe, eventually” option on the poll. This time I’m quarantine has made me consider and buy sets that I had previously overlooked
The branding style is starting to grow on me a lot. It struck me as odd that a fairground set like the Haunted House would have no fairground backdrop whatsoever and just be set in total darkness, but it works very well for a train model like this, or for the Old Trafford.
I really like what I see, even though I'm not into Crocodile locos and therefore won't be getting this one (I have a MOC I'm very happy with). Pleasantly surprised that it's designed for drop-in Powered Up and will run on regular LEGO track, despite using custom brick-built track for display.
And no one has pointed out yet that this is 7 studs wide in most areas, making this the first official 7-wide LEGO train model. I've always wanted to try 7-wide but been daunted by the techniques needed to make it work, so I'm excited to learn how they've accomplished this in a way that meets LEGO's design standards. My MOC has a 5-wide SNOT boiler on a 6-wide running board, which was fairly easy to do.
Tough crowd though...
Does look good. Might be able to incorporate the display stand into your layout.
Its beautiful! I don't have any LEGO trains, but a series of trains based on real locomotives with UCS-style displays is definitely something I would be in to. Mallard and Flying Scotsman next please.
looks a lot like 10183 and 4551 to me... Just that it's brown not red
@kolaxanthe said:
"Its beautiful! I don't have any LEGO trains, but a series of trains based on real locomotives with UCS-style displays is definitely something I would be in to. Mallard and Flying Scotsman next please."
Sadly, the Flying Scotsman was already done in the form of 10194 Emerald Night.
??? I really don't get it. Why does this Lego model consist of 3 separate parts with a big ugly gap between them?
On all the photographs the real train does look like it is one piece, without any gaps visible.
@BasJH said:
"??? I really don't get it. Why does this Lego model consist of 3 separate parts with a big ugly gap between them?
On all the photographs the real train does look like it is one piece, without any gaps visible."
It's because, unlike the real thing, the loco needs to articulate to be able to get around the extremely tight curves on Lego's tracks - unfortunate but completely necessary.
I don't get all the hate coming in for this set. I love it - it looks just beautiful, the colour scheme works very well and the build looks fantastic - very few specialised parts here. Will be buying this ASAP.
I don’t like brown. I don’t buy trains. But man, this is really cool (to me)!
Advanced trains are back!
I love this new approach to the branding and design. It can either be used as a display piece or put onto a track, or both!
The packaging really lets the design stand out. Mature builders don't need fancy artwork to set the scene; they can use their own imagination. Adding background detail only makes the artwork more toy-like, and at the end of the day this particular range isn't targeting children. It's about letting the customer understand that this piece can be appreciated both as a model for display, or as part of an interactive layout. The stand really captures this well.
I think it broadens the appeal of the products, particularly with a new generation of Lego fan entering the fray.
The negative comments don't sit well with me, either Yes, it may seem like an unusual train, but to the actual train enthusiast, this is a very interesting choice. And I believe that it has enough detail and history to warrant its existence.
@DB_Bricks said:
"It's because, unlike the real thing, the loco needs to articulate to be able to get around the extremely tight curves on Lego's tracks - unfortunate but completely necessary."
The real thing *is* articulated, for that very same reason, to get round tight curves. That's parly what makes it a good loco for LEGO to model.
I like it actually. lol! I don't mind getting one for display. Only gripe is its colour which will not pick up light easily. One way of overcoming it is to add carriages so it doesn't look dull and lonely. lol! Im not surprised Lego will release carriage sets separately...
@NickF22 said:
"What's with the horrible gap underneath the 3rd set of wheels from each end (in the side-on render on the set page)? I hope that's just the way it's rendered, with the red rubber tyres on the driving wheels - and not that those wheels actually hover above the track..."
The 2nd set of large wheels appear to have no flanges (or red rubber tyres) in the last photo. They may have done this so that you can place in-between two wheels with flanges in your own mocs, like the Emerald night train. There also seem to be discs hovering between the first set of large wheels, which although looks like the real train, does seem strange here having two wheels joined without a middle third, but then it is electric rather than steam.
I hope there would be more ELECTRIC locomotives, like the main Italian one (E656): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FS_Class_E.656
Wow, that's awesome, I love it.
I like this set and will probably get one, but the new "18+" packaging is horrible. There's just nothing attractive about it. If Brickset hadn't made me aware of it, I would probably ignore theses sets in a store, assuming them to be a clone brand.
Wow, that's awesome, I love it.
Not my favorite train by a long shot, but I might buy it anyway because I want to encourage Lego to make new trains more frequently.
I'm looking forward to seeing this running in that house with the cats, and the swimming pool in the garden.
I don't think I'll be getting it.
That's nothing like an Emerald Night... seriously disappointed.
I’m surprised that people like this a lot more than the Mickey and Minnie figures which are a million times better than a brown train, but then I remembered who this site’s main audience is ..
I really love this, I think it's a thing of beauty!
It look to be an interesting build also - Im getting one eventually.
Now I need Lego to make a product line of train waggons for it :)
Not the most exciting train to model, but I think it looks perfectly fine and will probably look better with cars in a contrasting color. I like the display stand, I've never seen LEGO do something like that before, but I wonder how much that adds to the part count and thus price...
Much better than the huge Disney figures if you ask me, that might actually be more niche. That set has some really interesting new parts in it but nearly $200 for a couple of unsettling statues? who aside from the most hardcore of disney fans would buy such a thing?
I find these "adult" sets kinda silly, being displayed in an "adult setting". We play with toys, and this is going to be displayed with the rest of mine!
The set is great. Exactly what I’ve wanted Lego to make for years.
@bananaworld said:
"
[...]
This brought sadness though:
"Real savvy builders should also be able to use old Power Functions motors in it, too."
If LEGO are hoping to attract buyers beyond the usual fan crowd, who probably aren't "real savvy builders", why make it difficult to use the "old" (but effective, and cheap) Power Functions? Why not design it so they can slot right on in too? The apps are alright, but adding too much complexity and extra barriers-to-entry detract from that "escapism"."
I'm guessing newcomers are more familiar with Bluetooth and their cellphones than they are with LEGO's infrared system. It's the fans that have any real knowledge and prior attachments/preference for the old Power Functions, and that are more likely to already have some of it or know how to get it for cheap.
This set isn't targeting people that are short on money either.
Certainly one of the better models and a good set overall. Too bad not my cup of tea.
My only fear is the color, the source material. Reddish brown elements are rigid and cracks easily.
In its historic brown livery, this is a must for me.
I have seen it live in green as Be 6/8 II as also its sister the Be 6/8 III.
I have it in HO.
https://www.cffhistoric.ch/collections/vehicules/locomotives/locomotives-electriques/ce68ii-14253.html
I think is wonderful. I am not into trains but in all my large dioramas I have a train and train stations and tunnels.
I am sad that City trains are not release at least every year.
It is perfect that they made a combination of a great display toy and an actual functional trains.
I don't understand the complaints about ugliness and color. It is a part of early 20th Century engineering history and cannot look like a 2020 TGV. It is like complaining about an Architecture set that is not looking like a building that we like most.
Only people who tried at least once to replicate a REAL thing are knowing how much work is into something like this compared with crazy "I do whatever I want" trains like the Hidden Side......one.
I hope LEGO will continue to make more locomotives and train cars to satisfy all the LEGO train lovers.
I lived the day to see a comparison between this locomotive an Micky & Minnie in a comment above.
I'm glad they made a new train again! Here's hoping that they will continue doing so after this one too!
Kinda disappointed in the new box design. It seems as though Lego just wanted to save on graphic design. And why shouldn't kids want these models? Just imagine the Ideas Yellow Submarine box without the great graphics from the movie or the most recent VW Beetle without that beautiful beach in the background! I'm not sure if I had bought either of those sets if it were not for the artistic boxes. These sets should be sold with a setting in mind. Without a setting, these sets come across as a lot more boring and easy to pass on. If I was 8 again I'm not sure I'd be nearly as excited about these sets as I was back when Green Grocer and Emerald Night came out. Why take away the imagination, Lego? Just seems like a cost-saving measure taken, rather than marketing them as "upscale display pieces" so children know from the beginning not to have an interest in them. I really hope future car models and modulars won't come in this standard and stick to settings they fit in. Besides, the 18+ branding is pretty stupid. Not only does it come off as sexual, but I would say most children who are into Lego are able to assemble any of these sets. It just seems like Lego is trying to exclude kids from being interested in any of the recent black box sets. Please Lego, bring back some imagination and design to the boxes! Okay enough from me.
Nice pieces- OK set.
Love it!
I'm slightly taken back by all the negativity in the comments section, but then again I don't usually peruse these anyway. The Croc is one of the few sets that I really, really wanted back in the decidedly more cash-strapped days of my uni studies, yet somehow slipped through the cracks. Before I knew it, its price had gone up beyond what I reckoned reasonable, even for a Factory set - and in the meantime, the old Town croc train set was commanding even more exorbitant fees. So I just told Brickset that I didn't want it anymore et voila - out of sight, out of mind.
Mind you, the trick had actually really worked - until a friend asked me earlier today what my thoughts were regarding the Crocodile train - and that brought back anxious memories of missing out on not one, but two eBay auctions when I could have gotten _that_ Factory set. Thankfully, he only wanted to pick my brains with regards to the next Trains set.
As you can tell, I'm as happy as a clam and have zero misgivings about this 6/8's seriousness, colour tone, unimaginative box, power-functions-aptitude, swooshability, or anything else for that matter. Yep, in my 30s a LEGO train is still perfectly capable of bringing a huge smile to my face -- surprisingly though, it now looks like I ought to consider myself lucky for that!
Wonderful train set, just as I expected. Hopefully the lack of enthusiasm from several means there will be more for me to find and buy in the months to come!
So is this minifigure scale?
That might be the ugliest Lego thing I've ever seen.
Nope. Not for half the price. And I'm currently building a Lego train set...
Give us a Class A4 in LNER blue!
As a train fan I like the model, but - adding to what others have said - I'm getting real tired of all the marketing nonsense coming out of LEGO lately (my opinion), as well as all the new and unusual things LEGO keeps trying out to see if anyone wants them (including this very locomotive). I wish more love and attention would go to existing themes, and I wish LEGO would just make up their minds whether or not they want to facilitate the model train hobby.
Really cool to see all the train experts in the comments.
Finally, a train set for adults. I do not understand why TLG do not take the opportunity of creating train sets like Santa Fe was. They would be able to make a fortune. Look, how expensive they are on the second market. Unfortunately this new one is poor chocie, but I am sure there will be lots of fan who will prurchase it anyway.
I've been super excited for the official reveal and if I didn't already have something else preordered, this would be a day one purchase. I love trains, but the recent really expensive or stylized ones haven't appealed to me. But one from the '20s? Yes please. I hope it sells really well so eventually a Western styled steam train can get the same treatment.
Nice to see LEGO making more trains. A definite favorite for many, but I hope they make a train like the Emerald Express someday. Nice set, but not really worth having for me.
Few notes;
1.
"We found that our last few trains did not appeal to people other than train fans" - That was very sad to hear, even if expected.
2.
"you can put on display in your living room and feel comfortable showing to your friends without having to justify having a toy in the living room" - If you need to justify something that's making you happy and hurt no one to your friends, they are not your friends. Keep in mind that this was written with adults in mind.
3.
The price is right, the design is OK. I'll get it of course, but I think that for the greater appeal they should've gone with something more classic. I would even say one of the first trains, or the ones similar to these crossing the US.
4.
Being a cheap set I expect many to get it as an investment, only to discover that there isn't much demand for it 6-7 years down the road.
@elangab Bear in mind perspective - to a low of people in the EU, the Crocodile is a *big* classic. Not everyone in the EU is familiar with North American trains. :) I think this is appealing more to the European market than the US market...though hopefully both find something to like in it, as sales of this will no doubt influence whether they make any more adult trains.
I personally am in for two of them. I love it. Personally the price is right and the locomotive is beautiful.
@elangab said:
"If you need to justify something that's making you happy and hurt no one to your friends, they are not your friends. Keep in mind that this was written with adults in mind."
I completely agree. I don't understand why he's making such a weird statement. It really rubs me the wrong way. Why market toward feelings of shame?
Since its a 10+ set can a 17 year old like me buy it? Dont see why i cant but wondering if the age thing applies?
Of all the great and fantastic looking locomotives from past and the present, Lego had a meeting and came up with this. That is the one, the electric poo! (Yes I know the colour is based the subject matter) but really?
I’m honestly just thoroughly confused....
From the interview:
“ We found that our last few trains did not appeal to people other than train fans. Of course, we love train fans, but we're just trying to make sure that, compared to our other products, trains are bringing in enough people.”
So their thought was to create this train?? Maybe I’ve misunderstood but I took that as meaning they are hoping to capture sales from other demographics, not just train fans.
Funny reading all the hateful or uninterested comments by people especially from outside Europe who don't seem to realize what a cult locomotive the original is to train enthusiasts.
It's an iconic machine like the US Big Boy, the British Mallard or the German V200.
@elangab: there is hardly a locomotive that is more of a classic than this one. Try Märklin models of it. From tinplate 0 gauge versions from the 1930s to more modern examples featuring gold plated hulls or even ones made out of platinum with diamonds for headlights.
https://www.maerklin.de/en/products/details/article/32560/
http://www.alte-spur-0.de/maerklin/lokomotiven/ccs66_12920_maerklin_elektrolok_20_volt_6_achsig_gruen_krokodil
This is almost a day one purchase for me. Almost, as by now I am spoiled by the train sets from BB that are much better value for money and aimed especially at German brick train fans. But I will buy this eventually, zero doubt about that. Only a matter of time.
@HUN_Sector said:
"My only fear is the color, the source material. Reddish brown elements are rigid and cracks easily."
That aspect of Reddish Brown parts was due to a quality defect in a certain batch of parts that as of last year has supposedly been rooted out. Older sets may still have that issue but new ones should not.
This lools great and all but it's not for me.
@AustinPowers and @miies
I agree with your statements, just think a steam locomotive would have a more worldwide appeal for non train lovers lego fans, relating to the goal of the designer (Not necessarily a North American model, didn't try to make it US centric with my comment).
It’s a beautiful model at a good price. Don’t own a train myself other than the Christmas one, but this looks excellent and makes me want it.
@matrox2001 said:
"Of all the great and fantastic looking locomotives from past and the present, Lego had a meeting and came up with this. That is the one, the electric poo! (Yes I know the colour is based the subject matter) but really?"
You write this as if TLG had only one shot at making an advanced train model.
This is just one of an existing series of products - and no doubt more will arrive in the future. There are many, many croc' train fans out there, just as there Mallard, Flying Scotsman, Big Boy fans.
The situation is no different to the modular building series; they're all interesting and original in their own right, but it's impossible to please everyone with each design choice.
Really happy there's finally another AFOL train set. The crocodile is as many have pointed out a classic on this side of the Atlantic.
It looks pretty good, and 7-wide is interesting. However a few aspects are disappointing:
- The size of the gaps
- The articulation points. The centre unit should hang between the two motor units, not have its own set of wheels.
- The colour. Why didn't they choose dark green? That would look so much better...
As one of those casual fans you'd think they'd be targeting, I was hoping for a re-release Emerald Night or something similar. Hopefully it won't be another 7 years before we get something from that classic steam era.
I wonder if the powered up parts for trains will ever be more affordable, adding a hub + Large motor is almost the same cost of the set.
More official photos can be found here:
https://www.brickfanatics.com/lego-10277-crocodile-locomotive-revealed/
I’ve bought every train related Lego set since 2006.
But this might just be my first pass!
Emerald Night, Maersk and Horizon Express were all fantastic.
This one just isn’t doing it for me.
Their 18+ reasoning just seems silly, they should have stuck to the creator expert tag if this is the way Lego trains are heading.
29 years ago, we got the Metroliner: 11 years ago, we got the Emerald Night. Today, Lego is selling us this giant brown turd dropped on a chunk of brick-built track. The build looks great, but the reddish brown is not very aesthetic compared to those sets. The base also doesn't really fit in with a lot of other displays: I would guess the Trains fans would have their own tracks already, whereas Creator Expert collectors would probably want something that integrates more easily into a modular display. I also prefer the name "Creator Expert" to "18+" since 12-year olds could build most of these.
Still, it's cool, and while I already have way too much Lego to buy (if Tree House would ever come back into stock), I would consider getting it.
@AustinPowers said:
This is almost a day one purchase for me. Almost, as by now I am spoiled by the train sets from BB that are much better value for money and aimed especially at German brick train fans. But I will buy this eventually, zero doubt about that. Only a matter of time. "
Now I'm intrigued... train sets from BB, you say?
I bought multiples of the previous Creator Expert trains because they included carriages along with the engines, a good incentive to make additional purchases. I'll eventually get this, but it will likely be just the one.
I do like the inclusion here of a brick built rail bed for presentation purposes.
Apart from the UCS style placard, hopefully all those other parts are printed as that would lend itself better to a display model. It certainly would help to sell the set to me if I was a prospective adult TLG was attempting to market to.
I was unsure about this when I saw leaks. The train looked nice, and even though I used to be a big Lego trains fan, I wasn't sure. But now I've read the article I can picture it sat on a bookshelf or somewhere similar, looking pretty damn good. So I'll be buying it.
Fantastic, can't wait to start building! I can imagine that if one is not familiar with this type of train, it may take some getting used to.
They didn't succeed in Lego Ideas, but now their projects have been turned into an official Lego set. A kind of advanced "Staff Pick" :-)
https://ideas.lego.com/projects/b100be81-413e-4aa8-98f2-f2c68354f5ed
https://ideas.lego.com/projects/899ca545-49a5-4102-aef8-154bb71ac6ea
@paulh said:
"They didn't succeed in Lego Ideas, but now their projects have been turned into an official Lego set. A kind of advanced "Staff Pick" :-)
https://ideas.lego.com/projects/b100be81-413e-4aa8-98f2-f2c68354f5ed
https://ideas.lego.com/projects/899ca545-49a5-4102-aef8-154bb71ac6ea
"
I wonder if these contestants consider suing LEGO - or at least hire an attorney and confront LEGO group for copyright infrigments..
I'm on the fence on this one. I was unfamiliar with the Crocodile, so I went looking for images of the real train. I think I'd have to wait and see what it will cost to swap out all the brown parts for either green or blue.
I think she’s a beauty. Trains are a weak spot since my childhood.
As a graphic designer (websites, UX and such) i have to agree. The black styling is not bad in the first place, but lets take some retrospective look at the FIRST ONE - UCS MF that came out with this new branding.. Very stylish BUT the "machine" (product) was pictured on a lively, brilliant background.. look at the the following UCS SW sets - Y-Wing front side also came with some radiant background pleasing the eyes.. Tantive IV? - not bad either.. but new A-Wing? What a SH-T-HOLE!! .. is it lost in some deep DEEP space where no stars exist no more??! The box art is a total loser - not to mention the positioning of the Star Wars element and other sings on the box -- simply not just "right" considering the distance from the box edges.. and this Locomotive and Haunted House are the SAME WASTE and SEWAGE (as for the box art, not the quality of the set)
no IMAGINATION! no behind scene to place the product into some "reality".. total waste! they should kick out that limited designer who suggested this approach. Its not appealing.. its APPALING.
@LukasM
As far as I know, when submitting a creation into LEGO Ideas you give up on any rights for your proposal. It was a big conversation point at that time.
Maybe they changed something meanwhile, but I never entered in the last 5 years after LEGO Ideas warned me because I just wrote in the commentary section that I wanted to contact a guy who proposed a creation to share some know-how about architecture.
After not entering on that site and completely avoiding entering on any link of LEGO Ideas, I was "lured" numerous times with a stupid click-bait like "people are following your creation". But I never submitted any creation on Ideas.
Finally, train set! This makes it instant buy no matter what, just to encourage LEGO to do more.
Crocodile is sort of traditional thing, so it makes sense. It super cool machine IRL too.
It's not all roses though. Brown is accurate color, but I think dark green would be way better.
Also model feels awkwardly top heavy. Size of these pantographs is correct, but (of course) model feels way too massive.
Also, I hope they will sell us some train cars too at some point in time ;)
I’ve never actually got a LEGO train, but this seems interesting enough.
@MetroiD said:
"Now I'm intrigued... train sets from BB, you say?"
I was told I am not supposed to talk too much about their sets here as they are not TLG products. But having just finished building the second of their new TEE carriages with the Diesel power units already waiting to be assembled, I can say for a fact that they have made huge strides in terms of quality and by now are almost on par with LEGO at a fraction of the cost and with really great designs modeled on real world prototypes like the aforementioned TEE, the Rheingold, and many more. Just google them to find out more.
And as a disclaimer, I have no affiliation with them whatsoever.
@Felix_Mezei said:
" @LukasM
As far as I know, when submitting a creation into LEGO Ideas you give up on any rights for your proposal. It was a big conversation point at that time.
Maybe they changed something meanwhile, but I never entered in the last 5 years after LEGO Ideas warned me because I just wrote in the commentary section that I wanted to contact a guy who proposed a creation to share some know-how about architecture.
After not entering on that site and completely avoiding entering on any link of LEGO Ideas, I was "lured" numerous times with a stupid click-bait like "people are following your creation". But I never submitted any creation on Ideas."
Oh, I did not know that regarding the waving the rights.. thanks for the explanation.
crazy looking but a good price IMO just might pick this up
@xboxtravis7992 said: If anything is going to hamper this set, its the drab color choice. As Bionicle fans might recall "brown sets don't sell."
I agree somewhat but think the original locomotive was also built in green, which might have been a better choice for LEGO here.
@LukasM said:
" @paulh said:
"They didn't succeed in Lego Ideas, but now their projects have been turned into an official Lego set. A kind of advanced "Staff Pick" :-)
https://ideas.lego.com/projects/b100be81-413e-4aa8-98f2-f2c68354f5ed
https://ideas.lego.com/projects/899ca545-49a5-4102-aef8-154bb71ac6ea
"
I wonder if these contestants consider suing LEGO - or at least hire an attorney and confront LEGO group for copyright infrigments.. "
They'd have to be dumb to even try and do so. Even if Lego Ideas didn't explicitly rule out that kind of legal action, those builders didn't invent the Crocodile locomotive, have no rights to it, and were not the first ones to try and build it out of Lego (Heck, Lego themselves have made two different sets of it over the past few decades). Shouting "you stole my idea" when somebody else independently comes up with a better version of the same thing you were building is something most builders grow out of.
122 comments and running!
Well, for being a not-so-exciting set it's stirring up quite a conversation. Thank you Lego for not forgetting us train freaks (which by the way are ageless - trains will always be appealing).
Now, I just don't get the Mickey vs Train thing: why are we supposed to take sides or belong to a certain audience or other, as someone said in a previous comment? What's it supposed to mean? That you have to be under-age to appreciate Lego? Trains are a crucial part of Lego history as much as other themes, and should be implemented. A new train was long overdue and this set is agelessly beautiful.
@LukasM
I see you are a specialist in graphic design and above in a commentary you have good points about the boxes.
It is time to ask you about your opinion on the City ones.
I mean the crazy bad shape of the background blue wall which in my opinion is trying subliminally to accustom us with the increasingly big problems LEGO has in the simple brick shapes in the last years.
I found for a lot of times big gapes between simple 1x... bricks and also a lot of differences in the size of the same type of part. It is present in any attempt to build a simple fine wall made of smooth bricks.
For more complicated LEGO parts it is even worst. I found more than a millimeter gape between the 2 parts that makes the transparent stag-deer in the Harry Potter set.
@Felix_Mezei said:
" @LukasM
I see you are a specialist in graphic design and above in a commentary you have good points about the boxes.
It is time to ask you about your opinion on the City ones.
I mean the crazy bad shape of the background blue wall which in my opinion is trying subliminally to accustom us with the increasingly big problems LEGO has in the simple brick shapes in the last years.
I found for a lot of times big gapes between simple 1x... bricks and also a lot of differences in the size of the same type of part. It is present in any attempt to build a simple fine wall made of smooth bricks.
For more complicated LEGO parts it is even worst. I found more than a millimeter gape between the 2 parts that makes the transparent stag-deer in the Harry Potter set."
I have to confess hat as for the City Line I do not know wha tis the primary target of LEGO Group.. it seems that they are trying to build up some "story" with all that minifigs with individual names on the front side of the box. Generally my impression is that they just degraded "city theme" to some 4-6 yrs old children.. the latest sets are so childish it makes you cry.. compare the new City Police station 60246 against 60141 .. precise 100 bricks less, price even higher and the looks? - awful! just plain AWFUL!
I wonder where TLG gets these ideas.. they certainly do not come of the blue skies (too expensive even for such a large company). But the target group must be in my opinion unprofessionally selected because the price of the 60246 + looks generally at whole despise ANY parent buyer in my vicinity from purchasing that for 8 yrs old and more as being "improperly childish".
@LukasM said:
"I wonder if these contestants consider suing LEGO - or at least hire an attorney and confront LEGO group for copyright infrigments.. "
Why would they sue LEGO.
It's based on a real locomotive (Ce 6/8 II) , and a famous one because it was used on the Gotthardbahn in Switzerland.
Model train brands made numerous of them.
@TeriXeri said:
" @LukasM said:
"I wonder if these contestants consider suing LEGO - or at least hire an attorney and confront LEGO group for copyright infrigments.. "
Why would they sue LEGO.
It's based on a real locomotive (Ce 6/8 II) , and a famous one because it was used on the Gotthardbahn in Switzerland.
Model train brands made numerous of them."
well .. as for the "suing" look at America were people were smoking cigarettes DESPITE the warning signs on the boxes were succesful at trials and got (I refuse to use term "earned") compensation in millions of USD. Look at the US now - its insane.. saying that Afroamerican has a black skin could get you either in prison or killed.
we found that previous trains only appealed to trains fans so we chose a really obscure and drab model...
Have they fixed reddish-brown, yet?
@xboxtravis7992:
I don't see them ever making a Big Boy. It's just too long for their track radius, and requires some insane articulation to make work. Besides, the Allegheny is a more powerful engine.
@ambr:
Steam drivers come prepacked in 2:1 ratio of flanged to unflanged. For most steam engines, this is necessary because it both allows you to pack the drivers closer together, and it allows the center wheel to slide over the inside rail on curves.
@24nolf:
I got dark-red 1x2 plates during several rounds of LUGBulk, early in the program. I built several MOCs using them afterwards, but last year when I got started building something new, I had a problem. About 90% of them attached to the studs like normal. The other 10% gave zero resistance when pressed down, because one side was popping off the instant the slightest bit of stress was applied.
@LukasM:
You can't copyright, patent, or trademark a basic concept, especially when that concept is "build something based off of 'X' real-world item". Neither of those models look anything like this beyond that they feature the same subject matter in the same color scheme. The physical builds are completely different.
It's a toss up between this and Dom's Charger for worst looking set this year.
@PurpleDave said:
"Have they fixed reddish-brown, yet?"
LEGO announced that they had fixed reddish brown, dark brown and dark red elements as of 2018: https://www.brickfanatics.com/the-lego-group-announces-quality-fix-for-reddish-brown-pieces Whether these new elements will last remains to be seen a few years down the road, but they seem confident based on their own monitoring. I myself have noticed many more brown models being released of late and I get the impression LEGO is going all out for this reason.
Sometimes it seems like Lego fans have such simple taste. I stopped counting how many comments here referred to this as being unpleasant looking based on the fact that it's brown or those who don't want anything other than the most benign and idealistic steam train possible.
I hate to think that because of this kind derision, Lego gets cold feet about developing anything really interesting and unique. Thank god they had the fortitude to develop this! To me, and I know to so many others, this train is aesthetically beautiful in it's intricacy and it's industrial beauty. Unfortunately we get drowned out by all of the people wanting more of the same.
Thank you Lego!
Wow; at first blush, I thought this was a Pennsylvania Railroad General Electric GG1. This Swiss CE 6/8 10277 Crocodile is an interesting locomotive.
It will appeal to the train fans but a pass from me. What I would like Lego to do is supercars in Creator Expert form. The technic cars, Porsche, Bugatti and Lambo are damn ugly in technic form but would look excellent in creator expert form like the VW Beetle and Mini from a few years ago.
@paulh said:
"They didn't succeed in Lego Ideas, but now their projects have been turned into an official Lego set. A kind of advanced "Staff Pick" :-)
https://ideas.lego.com/projects/b100be81-413e-4aa8-98f2-f2c68354f5ed
https://ideas.lego.com/projects/899ca545-49a5-4102-aef8-154bb71ac6ea
"
To me, this is the most relevant comment of this entire thread. Based on this alone, the set should be boycotted. The problem is: since Lego hardly ever listen to what fans want (classic space, castle, pirates, monorail, 9v trains, Technic where you see mechanisms, etc) ; therefore only producing what they want every 10 years, this is difficult for hardcore fan to boycott since they've been starved for so long. To me the set is fine, colour is accurate, marketing ploy is totally unnecessary - will have to see it in the flesh or in a proper review before deciding to commit - so far I can only say that I don't like the huge gaps.
The brown color is ugly, but it looks decent aside from that. Dark red or dark green would have been much better. The last Crocodile we got was bright red, and the Marklin Croc that has been on my wishlist (and is stupid expensive--makes this set look like a polybag in comparison) for ages is dark green.
I wonder what the minimum operating curve is--given the size of the locomotive--it's gotta be a huge radius!
Wow, the amount of negative comments about this set is overwhelming!!!
LEGO train fans have been asking for more detail and individual engines / rolling stock. We get that & LEGO just gets hate.
Seriously a ton of whiney fans...
Sorry but this looks more like an amateur MOC from first glance than an official LEGO release. Maybe it's because I'm not in love with trains but this isn't what I'd consider a good looking train. The color definitely doesn't help.
It’s so vibrant in brown.
I like it for what it is, it also reminds me of the brilliant Factory set back when they had the 9V system
There's one thing I am curious about at the end of all this, which is the US packaging. Will LEGO still be required to print "Building Toy" on the box in the US?
Cool set. I'll be getting this one for sure!
For those who are complaining about the train type, colour, that it's an easy pass for them, etc.- if this one sells well, Lego will probably release more trains so its in our interest for this train to sell well.
“We found that our last few trains did not appeal to people other than train fans.“
Not hard to understand why. They only made 2 train sets (which are poorly designed imho) in the last few years and that’s it. No train station with beautiful building like 4544 or level crossing, no any other sets just like 4541. So how should the children put/connect “just trains” into their cities?
Seriously, we haven’t had a proper stand alone train since the Horizon Express and people are complaining?
This is great. I’m hoping it sells well so this can be a regular thing.
Thanks LEGO! Fan of trains so really looking forward to this one.
Complaints are funny - does it look like user submitted models on LEGO Ideas? Yes, unsurprisingly all the models, LEGO or otherwise look similar to the real thing. The user that linked the two Ideas look the same. So did they copy each other?
Don't like, don't buy. Why waste energy and negativity on complaining? Smile and move on.
Thanks @Huw for the interview with Jamie - best part of this news release
@vzarmo said:
"“We found that our last few trains did not appeal to people other than train fans.“
Not hard to understand why. They only made 2 train sets (which are poorly designed imho) in the last few years and that’s it. No train station with beautiful building like 4544 or level crossing, no any other sets just like 4541. So how should the children put/connect “just trains” into their cities?"
Jamie is not referring to the City trains not selling well, because those do. What he's talking about is Creator Expert trains not selling well. And yes, that includes the beloved Emerald Night.
There's more details in this video interview (by Zuseammengebaut, but in English) with Jamie, the relevant train section start around 27:50.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=m82sy2vlCNc
Even with AFOL train fans buying 4 copies of each Expert train set, it's not enough according to Jamie. So fingers crossed this new approach works, and we get more trains again going forward.
@labronco2 said:
"It's a toss up between this and Dom's Charger for worst looking set this year."
& @MTBrickHouse
I can understand that someone doesn't like the design of the real train, but could you please explain what is so bad about the implementation?
why didn't they rerelease the emerald night? so many good trains from that time (1920's) and they decide on a brown one that looks like a switch board.
I don't understand people not fans of trains, commenting negatively on this. I don't care about SW and you'll never see me saying that Millennium Falcon is too round or the color is not OK or else because simply I don't know how it should be and never going to buy for myself.
Somebody above was right to say a lot of people want the same thing re-re-re-release. If I didn't bought Emerald, that's it! If LEGO will re-release all what people didn't get at one time we will end up at the Police station situation at every 2 year almost the same thing.
Also, why to criticize this choice among locomotives? I am almost sure more locomotives and train cars will follow. Emerald and others were complete trains and Crocodile is only one locomotive. I think this is an encouraging fact that more will follow.
I was not into LEGO when first Architecture were released and they were ugly and simple in comparison with nowadays but now people struggling to get one of those Sears, Hancock.
Do you think LEGO doesn't have already done the next locomotive in this ,hopefully, series to come? I am sure the next Locomotive in this series will be more beautiful and more appealing, LEGO is just getting us used to this toy-display set with this Crocodile.
About sales.... is a perfect thing. This is only 100 euros not 200 or 300 as in some cases LEGO exaggerated and it is the best gift for older people birthday that are not necessarily into LEGO.
As a display piece, is better than Emerald because some people not into LEGO will never display a full train in their office or house furniture because is more or a toy looking than a model, but a not so long locomotive will fit better.
In 10 years people will complain about not re-releasing Crocodile like we complain now about Santa Fe and Emerald.
Ok, I love this. It screams character to me, it doesn't look like the norm (ie cargo trains) and although one of the beautiful things about the Emerald Night is its colour, the design of this is amazing and interesting.
I am not a train fan, I have two (the Emerald Night and Lone Ranger Constitution, because I found those two to be interesting sets). However, I honestly find this set to be beautiful, there is so much character and depth with the colour imbuing a rustic aesthetic.
Yep, I really like this set.
6 wide, I'll pass. Waiting for 8 wide train.
@Felix_Mezei said:
"Also, why to criticize this choice among locomotives? I am almost sure more locomotives and train cars will follow. Emerald and others were complete trains and Crocodile is only one locomotive. I think this is an encouraging fact that more will follow."
This.
We get goodness knows how many modular buildings, vehicles, landmarks, UCS Star Wars sets and more advanced models, but the one rare occasion a train comes along, non-train fans tear it apart for no good reason other than that they wouldn’t normally buy a Lego train.
We should be as supportive as possible.
@Nesquik
I think we have the same opinion or not?
i was saying maybe this Crocodile is just the first from a new series and nicer or more appealing locomotives will follow.
For this reason I was comparing this first display+functional locomotive with the first Architecture set.
You said we have many Modular and I was saying the same thing: let's be supportive and ask people not into trains to stop criticize if they don't like the history of engineering or trains.
To go on your Modular example, maybe some guys criticized in the beginning the choice of the first modular without knowing that every year will have plenty of different colors and shapes and types.
Nowadays "everyone is entitled to an opinion" but we forgot not all the opinions have the same importance.
If I am in the business of replicating real things from LEGO parts in the last 7 years and I say the Statue of Liberty 21042 has a too short raised hand, a too long neck and at least other 10 mistakes, then probably my opinion is more important than an opinion of mine about SW where I am not interested in.
If @AustinPowers as apparently a specialist in trains, then I listen to his opinion and trust his point without even bothering to search for the real life Crocodile's pictures.
If I may joke:
If LEGO doesn't listen us anyway with Castle, Pirates, Western, then worrying for bad comments from people who will not buy a train (even if is the nicest one possible) is also not a threat.
@gsom7 said:
"6 wide, I'll pass. Waiting for 8 wide train."
It's 7-wide.
I'm bit disappointed again. I got all excited when it said new train, then looked at the picture and thought 'oh.'
Out of all the trains in all of time, in all the world, they had to chose this one?
I'm glad it wasn't a re-release of Emerald Night, I paid a fortune for that set off ebay. It would have been nice if they could do extra carriages though for previous sets.
Nope, I'll pass.
As a train fan hoping for more in this line, I am a bit concerned that they chose this locomotive to kick it off with as it’s not the most appealing model for those that they claim they want to target - non-train fans who want a good display piece. Surely a more striking engine, such as ‘Rocket’ or ‘Mallard’ would have fitted the brief better?
However, speaking personally I’m delighted at the set and this is a day one purchase for me... :)
@chrisaw said:
"Seriously, we haven’t had a proper stand alone train since the Horizon Express and people are complaining?
This is great. I’m hoping it sells well so this can be a regular thing."
Because those people dont know the history behind the locomotive and they dont care about trains to begin with. I'm buying this set because it's a beautiful set and what interests me is the 4 5v tracks that includes which is a nice Easter egg from the early 1980s
I KNEW this was coming eventually. I blame all the train buffs!!!! why Why WHY did they have to give this .............. thing so much attention. What a Croc!!! Well not my cup of tea but as mentioned above I still want to see it sell so we can hopefully see more at a more regular pace.
@Felix_Mezei : Also, why to criticize this choice among locomotives? I am almost sure more locomotives and train cars will follow.
Yes train cars tend to follow the locomotive :)
@LegoSonicBoy said:
" @PurpleDave said:
"Have they fixed reddish-brown, yet?"
LEGO announced that they had fixed reddish brown, dark brown and dark red elements as of 2018: https://www.brickfanatics.com/the-lego-group-announces-quality-fix-for-reddish-brown-pieces Whether these new elements will last remains to be seen a few years down the road, but they seem confident based on their own monitoring. I myself have noticed many more brown models being released of late and I get the impression LEGO is going all out for this reason."
I hope as during this period I took my new free time to rebuild some of my sets form 2010, 2011 and 2012 and I broke already 3 Reddish Brown tiles and one Dark Brown plate.
And I have notice that the reddish brown are more mat and sound really fragile now when you build.
I have no issue by now with New Dark Red pieces or minifigures, but heard from people that they have issues especially with the Atlantis sets.
@deejdave
Yes your joke is very nice. Let's hope some other train cars and locomotives will follow, and why not a separate series, because for sure is a demand.
Unfortunately it is also a possibility that this will be a singular experiment.
After 2012 Sopwith Camel 10226 nothing followed...
@stlux said:
" @vzarmo said:
"“We found that our last few trains did not appeal to people other than train fans.“
Not hard to understand why. They only made 2 train sets (which are poorly designed imho) in the last few years and that’s it. No train station with beautiful building like 4544 or level crossing, no any other sets just like 4541. So how should the children put/connect “just trains” into their cities?"
Jamie is not referring to the City trains not selling well, because those do. What he's talking about is Creator Expert trains not selling well. And yes, that includes the beloved Emerald Night.
There's more details in this video interview (by Zuseammengebaut, but in English) with Jamie, the relevant train section start around 27:50.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=m82sy2vlCNc
Even with AFOL train fans buying 4 copies of each Expert train set, it's not enough according to Jamie. So fingers crossed this new approach works, and we get more trains again going forward."
Thank you for the link, interesting, but I don't totally agree with Jamie as I remember in the months before Christmas 2011 it was already sold out everywhere. So I was unable to buy as a present, nor I suppose were any non-train Lego fans able to buy. Similar thing happened with the Horizon Express in Christmas 2014. Jamie also mentions the Lego winter creator expert train, but the Hogwarts Express was more complicated.
@Felix_Mezei : You are correct. Was just a little humor but as I said even not being a fan of this specific design I certainly hope Creator style trains will be a more regular theme/topic. They certainly have the fanbase. I am dreaming I know but I would LOVE to see licensed trains handled similar to the Speed Champions line. There is such a difference in the City trains and sets such as the Santa Fe, Maersk, & Emerald Night. Obviously a market for the City style trains but definitely a market for more realistic trains. Lego collectors, train collectors & expert model builders alike would all welcome this and these guys SPEND!! Perhaps handled like a cross between "Speed Champions" and "My Own Train" themes. Then come the buildings!!! I feel like the modulars have brought us to a point where this could be a possibility and could really work...........
@labronco2 said:
"It's a toss up between this and Dom's Charger for worst looking set this year."
Get the Mickeys in that list instead of this beautiful piece of Lego Trains artwork.
Gees, I can't stand just how biased I sound.
A definite buy for me!
@ambr:
Availability does not necessarily correlate to how well the set sold. Is it unavailable because people were climbing over each other to snatch up every last copy, or was it because there just weren't many produced to begin with? My dad's late uncle managed to buy an original Dodge Viper RT/10 from the dealer, but it took a lot of persistence. Turns out every dealership got _one_, and most liked to park it out front where it would draw potential customers in (come in to check out the flashy sports car, leave with something more sensible). He kept making offers on it, and the dealer kept turning him down, but eventually he couldn't resist an all-cash offer and sold it to him. So, it was hard to get your hands on one, but not because tons of people were buying them. There just weren't many available.
@BD247 said:
"why didn't they rerelease the emerald night? so many good trains from that time (1920's) and they decide on a brown one that looks like a switch board."
The Emerald Night was just a fantasy train with no real life counterpart. And it was not even a very realistic looking thing if one is honest. The only thing it has going for it is the nice colour scheme.
This otoh is quite a good representation of the source material, with the biggest gripes being the huge gaps (which were necessary though in order to make it usable within the constraints of the LEGO train system geometry) and the wrong implementation of the bogies/drive units in relation to the central part of the chassis. But again this might have been too complicated to implement more realistically.
I also don't understand why people have a problem with the brown colour. Imho (remember, beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder) the actual machine looks better in brown than in the dark green version that also existed in real life. But even if LEGO made the dark green version, the shape that many critizise would remain the same.
And @coenstegeman re:
"feel comfortable showing to your friends without having to justify having a toy in the living room"
This is the saddest sentence I have read in some time and also a very poor way to market your own brand."
Indeed. It gives an interesting insight into the mindset of these people. They apparently don't understand the universal appeal of many of their products.
I have never in my life (fortunately) met a person as sad and single-minded as to have critizised "having a toy in the living room". What a stupid thing to critizise anyway. How low does one have to sink as to be that superficial?
Come to think of it, if one is a guest in another one's house, what kind of behavior is it to criticize their choice of decorations?
But honestly, that mindset explains many of the decisions by TLG in recent years.
@yap said:
"I hope as during this period I took my new free time to rebuild some of my sets form 2010, 2011 and 2012 and I broke already 3 Reddish Brown tiles and one Dark Brown plate.
And I have notice that the reddish brown are more mat and sound really fragile now when you build."
I must have been extremely lucky as I never experienced anything like this with any piece in any colour since the Eighties, when pieces in general appeared to be of lesser quality/more brittle.
I have tons of pieces in reddish brown and they appear to be as good in quality as all the others.
As for (New) Dark Red, the main problem with that appears to be the inconsistency of the shade of the colour, which when I look at my collection is all over the place. A quick count just now showed that I have at least seven distinctly different shades of the colour.
@coenstegeman said:
""feel comfortable showing to your friends without having to justify having a toy in the living room"
This is the saddest sentence I have read in some time and also a very poor way to market your own brand."
Exactly! "Toys" have been displayed in my (living) room for ages, and I don't recall ever having received a pityingly look. Only people being interested.
@AustinPowers said:
" @BD247 said:
"why didn't they rerelease the emerald night? so many good trains from that time (1920's) and they decide on a brown one that looks like a switch board."
The Emerald Night was just a fantasy train with no real life counterpart. And it was not even a very realistic looking thing if one is honest."
I think its obvious the Emerald Night was based on LNER Pacifics, particularly those like Tornado and Flying Scotsman.
You know Flying Scotsman, the most famous train in all railfan history?
Yes Emerald Night isn't a perfect Scotsman model, theboiler is "to fat" and lacks the leanness of Flying Scotsman (and ends up looking almost more American than British due to the big boiler). But it's still pretty obvious Emerald Night is supposed to be Scotsman, and while I'd expect higher detail from Lego now... back in 2009 Emerald Night was a HUGE step forward for official Lego Train designs.
@xboxtravis7992 said:
"You know Flying Scotsman, the most famous train in all railfan history?"
If course I do, but whether I would call it the most famous, that's certainly debatable.
The Rheingold, the Shinkansen, the Big Boy, and above all, the Orient Express. Ever heard of that one? ;-)
I do hope that Lego addresses that they re-did a design by Holger Matthes. Not to say you can't create your own version and he owns a "design" but to copy the identical color to his. If you look at his book its clearly the same. Obviously the train could have been done in Dark Green (though would have been similar to Emerald Night) or Dark Blue, Maroon or Dark Red... Tons of options. @lego
@AustinPowers:
Don't count yourself lucky, yet. I had a set of 4x 4x4 quarter round plates in reddish-brown that I used twice a year as a base for a giant Christmas tree. I used them in November with no problem, but they splintered when I tried to use them again in December. You won't know if you got a bad part until it gives out, and nobody seems to have had any issues with them right after they were shipped. This is a problem that manifested with age. Some chemical reaction/degradation must have been slowly taking place. Once it hit a certain point, the structural integrity falls below the threshold required for LEGO clutch strength.
If they don't come up with some rolling stock to hook up to it, the play-ability of this set is lost. I have harped for a long time that LEGO has neglected the Train community for a long, long time. One off specialty engines with one rail car are not addressing what is probably a hungry group waiting to spend money on some legitimate sets. I am one of those people who did buy multiple copies of the Maersk set, Santa Fe Super Chief and the BNSF along with the TTX Inter-modal cars but this is my Lego passion. Everyone in the LEGO community has their passion they focus on and they should enjoy it to the fullest.
Wait so did Jamie design this set?